S900 Owner's Thread and Mini Build Log

econfly

Member
I've used DJI's NAZA, WKM and A2. I think each can be the right choice. It just depends on what you want.

For a cost-efficient smaller build, the NAZA is great. You are limited to 7 channels, which can be a pain if you have an H3-3D and want to control tilt, for example, because you end up giving up something (either intelligent orientation control or the ability to put gains on a dial/slider). But for simply builds the NAZA is a winner.

The WKM is my choice for just about anything else. It brings the same limitations as the NAZA (7 channels), but this won't matter if you are using a 2-radio setup for copter/gimbal. If needed you can always route channels directly from the RX (either direct PWM or using an S.bus splitter with, e.g., the Lightbridge). The WKM is very reliable and doesn't seem to have the level of issues that you hear about with the A2.

I didn't have any A2 problems, but I also didn't want/need the added functionality it offers so I sold it. It bundles a lot into a single product, and that has its strengths and weaknesses. If you like the bundle (RX, channel mapper, etc.) then it could be a solid choice. For a larger build with a full-sized gimbal the A2 is the easiest 1-man setup and integrates optimally with other DJI products (LightBridge, Zens). But if you don't plan to use the internal RX and don't want/need the other features, then the A2 is less of an obvious choice even for a DJI build. The A2 is the latest and greatest, and has the most rapidly evolving firmware of DJI's controllers. I prefer stable over evolving when it comes to FCs, so even without the complaints I see "new" as a negative, at least until the A2 firmware stabilizes (e.g., isn't updated for many months with widely-viewed reliable function).

One issue to note with the A2 is that complexity leads to operator/setup error and that leads to lots of complaining on the internet. I'm not saying the A2 isn't flawed (I honestly don't know one way or the other). But it is self-evidently a more complex product than the WKM or NAZA and there is more to setup and get right before flying. It interacts with more products (e.g., the internal RX), and that creates the potential for confusion as well. I would expect more complaining about the A2 just because of its wide feature set.

By the way, to see this complexity/intermediary problem in all its glory just go follow some LightBridge threads. It's been a rough road, but the LightBridge is turning into a pretty nice product (not completely there, but almost if they can get HDMI-out fixed for more devices and the iOS function into the app store). However, from a user's perspective the thing is just a mess and I can't see how it could be any other way given what it is trying to do. Firmware updates to manage for something like 5 systems, channel mapping that intermediates between the TX and the other channel maps on actual devices, setup that only works on a tablet or phone but in addition to other setup in assistant software, etc. It's workable, but just try explaining it to someone. The DJI support guys are having to do a ton of work on this one and it makes the A2 look trivially simple by comparison. So, all of this is relative.

For example, I'm using the LightBridge on my S1000. It's solely dedicated to the BMPCC Zen. I using 433MHz for flight control to avoid interference on 2.8GHz and because I didn't want to use the Lightbridge link for both flight and gimbal control (DragonLink -- you need a HAM license in the U.S.). So, for my setup the LB is simple enough to integrate. But to get it all working you have three devices to manage, update firmware, and set properly with DJI assistant software: the LB air unit, the LB ground unit, and the Zen GCU. And, on top of that, you must have a supported Android device to set some parameters on the LB ground unit. And this is about as simple as it gets. If one is using the LB to control flight there is even more to manage. I'm not say it's all that difficult, and once you get the concepts things go quickly. But just imagine some new user buying one and trying to get it to work.

Anyway, bottom line is the A2 is fine if you want/need the features, otherwise I would go with a WKM. The NAZA is great for smaller/simpler builds. Just depends on what you want.
 
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Dave_EP

Member
The WKM is my choice for just about anything else

Thanks for the extensive reply.

Now, suppose I go with either the S900 or S1000 but in each case go for the WKM with a 2 radio setup (my preference anyway), what two radio systems do you recommend? I'm totally new at the 2 radio solution, so I'm wondering how the frequencies interact / collide etc.

I'd be using the GH4 + Zen but don't feel the need for HD downlink since SD is fine for framing.
 

tikigod19

Member
I'm going to go for a 14sg and 8sg Dave. I just NEED to know the exact 100% precise weight of the s900 with all motors, cabling etc..! It's stopping me from pushing buy!
 

Dave_EP

Member
I'm going to go for a 14sg and 8sg Dave. I just NEED to know the exact 100% precise weight of the s900 with all motors, cabling etc..! It's stopping me from pushing buy!

TBH it's one of the only things that's making me hesitate too. My guess is keeping it to (below) 7kg is going to mean big compromises.
 

tikigod19

Member
Well I did some sums and I'm sure of you only want 8 mins or so it's doable but that was basing everything on dji's 3.3kg measurement. If I get it and it's 3.4kg I've as good as wasted several thousand pounds.. What to do..
 

Dave_EP

Member
Well I did some sums and I'm sure of you only want 8 mins or so it's doable but that was basing everything on dji's 3.3kg measurement. If I get it and it's 3.4kg I've as good as wasted several thousand pounds.. What to do..

Sandpaper & helium ;)
 

econfly

Member
Thanks for the extensive reply.

Now, suppose I go with either the S900 or S1000 but in each case go for the WKM with a 2 radio setup (my preference anyway), what two radio systems do you recommend? I'm totally new at the 2 radio solution, so I'm wondering how the frequencies interact / collide etc.

I'd be using the GH4 + Zen but don't feel the need for HD downlink since SD is fine for framing.

With an SD video downlink (say at 5.8GHz) you can just use two 2.4GHz radios. I would go with a Futaba 14SG for control (that way you can get voltage telemetry easily) and the Futaba 8FG for the gimbal. I've done this with no issues at all.
 


econfly

Member
When using wkm would you still have enough channels to manually tilt the gimbal if only using a single tx (14sg)

For a Zenmuse G3/G4/5D/BMPCC/etc. you have direct PWM inputs (each is its own channel) on the gimbal GCU. So you just take a channel from your receiver and feed it directly to the gimbal channel you want to control. With the Futaba 14SG and 7008SB receiver you put the receiver in mode C or D. That lets you send a single S.Bus2 connection to the WKM (channels 1-7) and then you can just connect 9, 10, 11 and 12 to the Zenmuse (9 is on the receiver port #1, 10 is on #2, etc.). This gets you the full 7 channels to the WKM and four to the Zenmuse. If you need a gear channel you are down to 3 on the Zenmuse. To go beyond this you can split the S.Bus on the air side, send one output to the WKM and the other to an S.Bus->PWM decoder. That will get you channels 8-12 as well as the 13-14 digital channels (ideal for gear and two-way switches). It's more work and cost, but you can effectively use all 14 channels if you go this route.
 


ZAxis

Member
Another question to Tahoe Ed...
Have just read through the S900 manual and it seems there is a different arrangement for the motor anti vibration isolators compared to the existing S1000. Between the motor mounting plate and the rubber grommets are a pair of copper discs. I assume these are part of an answer to the excessive wear rate of the existing S1000 arrangement. So, are these new copper discs compatible with the S1000 and are the grommets the same? I suppose I should also ask if they're going to be made available to existing S1000 users, free of charge, if they are compatible.

andy
 

Tahoe Ed,

GREAT thread with lots of info! Thanks for doing such a great job outlining everything and sharing all this info.

Mike
 

Tahoe Ed

Active Member
Have just read through the S900 manual and it seems there is a different arrangement for the motor anti vibration isolators compared to the existing S1000. Between the motor mounting plate and the rubber grommets are a pair of copper discs. I assume these are part of an answer to the excessive wear rate of the existing S1000 arrangement. So, are these new copper discs compatible with the S1000 and are the grommets the same? I suppose I should also ask if they're going to be made available to existing S1000 users, free of charge, if they are compatible. andy

Andy, I don't know. I am not planning to tear one of my motors apart on the S900 and then one on my S1000 to compare. I did not notice the difference. That was a nice catch. Where did you get the material as copper? I did not see that. I doubt if DJI will provide this upgrade free of charge. I would look at it as an option to purchase if the parts are compatible. They are close to shipping and we should have a full manual soon. That may answer more of these questions.
 

ZAxis

Member
Ed..
I was hoping you'd ask DJI rather than tear your machines apart!
The S900 manual is on DJI's web site now and the section on the grommets is
attachment.php

It's an interesting thing for DJI to do. Don't know if it's to fill a gap or prevent chafing but if the copper wears and drops into the ESC it could be rather unwelcome.
I hope this means the S900 will not go through the grommets at the same rate as the S1000 seems to.
cheers
andy
 

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Tahoe Ed

Active Member
I just pulled the manual from the website and what I see ends at page 31 and does not show the detail that yours does. Can you provide me with your link?
 

ZAxis

Member
I just pulled the manual from the website and what I see ends at page 31 and does not show the detail that yours does. Can you provide me with your link?
I pulled down the .zip manual link on the DJI S900 downloads page. The bit I cut out is at the bottom of page 25

cheers
andy
 

Tahoe Ed

Active Member
I pulled down the .zip manual link on the DJI S900 downloads page. The bit I cut out is at the bottom of page 25

cheers
andy

I was opening the PDF version of the manual assuming that they would both be the same. They are not. I agree that they are to prevent the chaffing of the CF on the grommets. They should work on both the S900 and the S1000. The problem will be when will the dealers get them and will they be included in the grommet orders? I don't know but I will bring it up to DJI.
 

Tahoe Ed, Great work and keep the info coming. Can't wait to see some more media from that thing. Quick question now that you have flow it. Have you adjusted your gains any from what you mentioned earlier in the thread? And second, just as a check can you share the IMU location measurements you used in A2 setup?

Thanks and rock on!
 

Tahoe Ed

Active Member
Tahoe Ed, Great work and keep the info coming. Can't wait to see some more media from that thing. Quick question now that you have flow it. Have you adjusted your gains any from what you mentioned earlier in the thread? And second, just as a check can you share the IMU location measurements you used in A2 setup?

Thanks and rock on!

The gains are unchanged and the same as my S1000. I am using the bottom plate as Z=0. The IMU is X -7 and 0,0 for Y & Z.
 


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