Aeronavics / Droidworx New Build Planned - SkyJib-X4 Heavy Retractable

[ichwillnix]

Hi All,

the USER MANUAL for Herkules III Setup is now online. As i am working still on some chapters please check for updates in the next days.
http://www.andreasbaier.de/index.ph.../viewcategory/8-herkules-iii-programming-tool.

I included also description for Telemetry setup, and different Multicopter Mounting proposals. I hope this manual answers the basic questions about the mysterious Herkules ESCs...

Please feel free to give me feedback if something is missing or written in "strange" words...

Andreas

 

[Cheshirecat]

Hi Guys,

there is another good working Koax8-Setting. This is even more safe with HERKULES III because:

1) The Top Herkules QUAD-ESC (all on one PCB) spin the Top Motors as a fully self-running Quad-copter
2) The Bot Herkules QUAD-ESC spin the BOT Motors also as a self running Quad-copter.

So if in worst case one complete Herkules quad-ESC would fail, the copter would be "at leased" controllable and should be able to land in a controlled way
I personally fly this setting and the stability is even better than the original DJI proposal.

This setting is more or less the same as the Mikrokopter Setting and is working really perfect!

The Motor Mixing Table for this setting will be attached in the Herkules User Manual. This is also almost ready for release.
=> If using on Top and Bot the same propellers, the upper ones should run about 5% slower than the lower ones. This improves the overall-efficiency and balances the power better between top and bottom.


By the way: The Telemetry Interface is now also ready for delivery.

Currently tested and released are the following Telemetry interfaces:

1. Jeti Duplex (+ EX)
2. Graupner Hott

Currently in Beta-Test:

1. Futaba S-BUS
2. Multiplex M-Link
3. JR Telemetry
4. Hitec
5. Spektrum

A detailed description of the features will follow soon...

Thanks Andreas

I will take a close look at this setup when i swap out the standard Herkules motor breakouts for the telemetry board you shipped to me.
Just need to work out how to set it up :dread:

I am hoping it will work with teh telemetry on my Futaba 14SG so i can see the Current drawn from the LiPos in flight as i am mis judging the flight time at the moment (on the safe side though)

 

[Cheshirecat]

It has been a little Mysterious but once you have it cracked it is an excellent piece of equipment, i am really gald i broke my planned budget and opted for the Herkules III.
The SJ X4 Doesnt even seem to break a sweat running with it's full payload and the Motors and LiPos are barely warm to the touch after a full flight even with the ambient temperature in the 30 Degree range.

 

[RyanMcCrae]

I noticed you are running a 100mw vtx, hows the range on that?

 

[baja-king]

I noticed you are running a 100mw vtx, hows the range on that?

Good, certainly for the 122m high and 500m distance 'bubble' VLOS that I fly it within...

 

[Skippwash]

Hello Baja-king, newbie here. Outstanding build, a dream machine. Just out of curiosity how much do you have into your whole system? Trying to figure out my budget. Thanks.

 

[baja-king]

Hi Skippwash, welcome to the forum!

OK some ball park figures... (Inc VAT)

Skyjib X4 Ti £2200
DJI WK-m/A2 £900
Motors £600
Herkules III £1200
Telemetry £200
Props £250
Zenmuse £2500
Jeti DS-16 £1100
DX8 (for gimbal) £200
GH2 +Accs £1250
Cables/Tools etc £500
Batteries/Chargers £1000
Cases £500

Total approx £12,400

My advice, get VAT registered and save yourself the 20% - have a look at the BeSteady One instead of the Zenmuse

And remember if you want to use commercially in UK you need BNUC-S™ Certificate + CAA 'Permission for aerial work' + Public Liability Insurance

Steve

Hello Baja-king, newbie here. Outstanding build, a dream machine. Just out of curiosity how much do you have into your whole system? Trying to figure out my budget. Thanks.

 

[Skippwash]

Outstanding!! However I must say I live in USA. Thank you so much for giving me a figure to shoot for, I can convert to US$. Pleasure meeting you.

Hi Skippwash, welcome to the forum!

OK some ball park figures... (Inc VAT)

Skyjib X4 Ti £2200
DJI WK-m/A2 £900
Motors £600
Herkules III £1200
Telemetry £200
Props £250
Zenmuse £2500
Jeti DS-16 £1100
DX8 (for gimbal) £200
GH2 +Accs £1250
Cables/Tools etc £500
Batteries/Chargers £1000
Cases £500

Total approx £12,400

My advice, get VAT registered and save yourself the 20% - have a look at the BeSteady One instead of the Zenmuse

And remember if you want to use commercially in UK you need BNUC-S™ Certificate + CAA 'Permission for aerial work' + Public Liability Insurance

Steve

 

[Akermay]

Great thread! I've just started looking into the SkyJib X4 and it seems like a front runner when to comes to choice. However this will be our first self built copter. In the past we have only had ARTF kits so its a little daunting as you could imagine.

My main confusion is with power distribution for sure. Could someone explain why the Herkules III is so good to a layman? Because the price difference is a whopper.

 

[Cheshirecat]

My main confusion is with power distribution for sure. Could someone explain why the Herkules III is so good to a layman? Because the price difference is a whopper.

Is the difference as much as it appears though? by the time you have 8 X high quality ESC's and a power distribuition board the gap narrows.
With the Herkules you get a motor controller built to very high quality with the best components in a very neat package that is easy to build in to the frame.
The efficiency of the design is evident in that neither the Herkules or any of the motors get beyond "just warm to the touch" on a full weight flight for the duration of the Lipos.
Add to that high quality fault tolerence (shorts etc...) and superb technical support from Andreas.
It also supports full telemetry for a wide range of radios (Futaba coming soon, good for me) so a very sophisticated level of control as well.

I did not originally budget for the Herkules either, but after much reaserch decided it was a no brainer to keep 10K worth of kit out of the evil clutches of gravity.
If/When i build another that will have a Herk as well.

 

[Skippwash]

Is the difference as much as it appears though? by the time you have 8 X high quality ESC's and a power distribuition board the gap narrows.
With the Herkules you get a motor controller built to very high quality with the best components in a very neat package that is easy to build in to the frame.
The efficiency of the design is evident in that neither the Herkules or any of the motors get beyond "just warm to the touch" on a full weight flight for the duration of the Lipos.
Add to that high quality fault tolerence (shorts etc...) and superb technical support from Andreas.
It also supports full telemetry for a wide range of radios (Futaba coming soon, good for me) so a very sophisticated level of control as well.

I did not originally budget for the Herkules either, but after much reaserch decided it was a no brainer to keep 10K worth of kit out of the evil clutches of gravity.
If/When i build another that will have a Herk as well.

Well said!! Although I am extremely new to the scene, I agree. If you are going to spend that amount of $$$ on a Hobby/Profession, do your research and go with what will keep your investment as safe as possible. Unless of course you've got it like that:greedy_dollars: LOL.

 

[Mojave]

Baja-king great log of your build - thanks.

Why do you suggest having a look at the BeSteady One? I am sure that you choose the Zenmuse carefullt; what do you know about the BeSteady?

... My advice, get VAT registered and save yourself the 20% - have a look at the BeSteady One instead of the Zenmuse ...

 

[garyl]

Advice please

Hi Steve,

I have been looking at building the same set up as you. Are you happy with your X4? I am also hesitating with the Skyjib 6 ! also are you using DJI or other system? Any advice would be helpful...
Thank you
Gary

Hi Folks,

I'm Steve

I'd like to introduce myself - I've been lurking around the forums for some time and I'm now looking for some advice on a new build...

I’m planning on something bigger that will take my current gimbal (Zenmuse) and then more as the time comes...

I have decided after much though on the following shopping list:

SkyJib-X4 Heavy Retractable
KW10 V2 pro Motors x8
KW80E advanced esc x8
Droidworx’s Power distribution Board x 1
Xoar prop 15x5

I already have:
DJI - WKM
Zenmuse (GH2)
8 x 6s 8300mHa Lipo

Questions:
Has anybody had any experience with the KW80E/KW60E ESC?
These were recommended for by Kopterworxs - my budget will not stretch to a Hercules board at the moment, so I’m looking for a set of ESC’s that will handle more weight when I go with heavier payloads than the Zenmuse... Is 80A overkill...?

KW10 V2 pro motors - Tiger Motors? any feedback on these....

Power Distribution boards - 1 or 2....

Also any thoughts on different size props on the bottom motors...

Many thanks in advance :nevreness:

 

[baja-king]

Hi Gary, welcome to the forum

I'm very happy with my X4, does everything I want of it and more... (am using DJI WK-m on FW 5.20)

When I started looking into multi rotors the different choices make the mind boggle, it comes down to simple choices really:

How much weight are you looking to lift?
What's the weather like where you want to use it?
How big is your car/van for transportation?
How much do you want to spend?

I wanted to build a rig that would cope with a Zenmuse and GH2 to begin with but had some head room for carrying a bigger camera at a later date.
That made me look at the SkyJib Flat 8 and the coaxial X4. Because the weather is so variable in the UK I decided on the X4 because it is less affected by windy conditions.
The added benefit of the X4 over the Flat 8 is size, at 1160mm diameter the Flat 8 is quite a behemoth... (although on paper the Flat 8 is more efficient)
I have spent twice as much as I originally anticipated - but I agree with the old adage 'If you by cheap, you buy twice'


What catches your eye about the SkyJib 6?

Steve

 

[Bluerex]

+1 for coax octa layout!!!
I have the (now discontinued) DW XM coax and it rides round in the boot of the car quite happily between gigs. I fly with a guy who has the larger SkyJib octa coax. He has had an ESC die (magic smoke came out) and a prop fly-off mid flight (don't ask) - in both cases the SJ flew and landed normally. That's enough for me :frog:

Charles.

 

[garyl]

Skyjib x4

Hi Steve,

Thank you very much ! it is really good to have some independent advice ! Those who sell frames and parts never seem to have much time for advice !
I have been looking for a couple of months now and my search has been based on carrying a Sony PJ780 video camera which seems to give good results for my use.
I spoke to Droidworx in New Zealand and they have advised me to go for the X4 as it will give me other options in the futur too ! I work in the south of France where the
wind often blows ! so I thought this was a good option. Up to now my experience has been with DJI so I have wanted to stick with then for the controller. I was pretty motivated until
I spoke to a man yesterday who is specialized in putting rigs together and he didn’t understand my choice ! and said a Flat 6 was better with Microcopter ! I have been
thinking about this for the last 24h and have decided to ignored his advice as I think he is just used to microcopter and flat systems but he did make me wonder about going
for a flat 6 as it always seems simpler to set up. Your experience conforts my decision. I have been thinking of going for the new DJI A2 but I am not sure it is quiet stable yet !


Did you have any trouble in setting / building it?


Thanks again for your help.


Gary

Hi Gary, welcome to the forum

I'm very happy with my X4, does everything I want of it and more... (am using DJI WK-m on FW 5.20)

When I started looking into multi rotors the different choices make the mind boggle, it comes down to simple choices really:

How much weight are you looking to lift?
What's the weather like where you want to use it?
How big is your car/van for transportation?
How much do you want to spend?

I wanted to build a rig that would cope with a Zenmuse and GH2 to begin with but had some head room for carrying a bigger camera at a later date.
That made me look at the SkyJib Flat 8 and the coaxial X4. Because the weather is so variable in the UK I decided on the X4 because it is less affected by windy conditions.
The added benefit of the X4 over the Flat 8 is size, at 1160mm diameter the Flat 8 is quite a behemoth... (although on paper the Flat 8 is more efficient)
I have spent twice as much as I originally anticipated - but I agree with the old adage 'If you by cheap, you buy twice'


What catches your eye about the SkyJib 6?

Steve

 

[baja-king]

No Problem.

It's the same everywhere, you get a guy who dives an Audi will usually try and tell you you should get and Audi vs BMW... the same with DJI vs Microkopter.

I think that no FC system is bomb proof, what your making is an uneducated guess... in my experience DJI works BUT, and it's a big but, you need to test, then test and then test again...

One of the reasons I'm building an XM-X4 test rig http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?15547-New-XM-X4-Build is because I want to be able to test firmware upgrades and prop combos down at my
local flying field and be satisfied that everything works as it should do before implementing the changes on my £10k SkyJib

As to the A2, Dave/Boris or somebody else needs to chime in here because I don't have any experience of it. However what I have read so far has put me off taking the plunge...

Remember that you can get a good deal on the WK-m promotions running at the moment http://www.buildyourowndrone.co.uk/DJI-Wookong-M-Promotion-p/dji-wookong-promotion.htm

No problems setting/building it, thanks to this forum, the Encyclopedia of Multi Rotors

BTW I drive an Audi...

Hi Steve,

Thank you very much ! it is really good to have some independent advice ! Those who sell frames and parts never seem to have much time for advice !
I have been looking for a couple of months now and my search has been based on carrying a Sony PJ780 video camera which seems to give good results for my use.
I spoke to Droidworx in New Zealand and they have advised me to go for the X4 as it will give me other options in the futur too ! I work in the south of France where the
wind often blows ! so I thought this was a good option. Up to now my experience has been with DJI so I have wanted to stick with then for the controller. I was pretty motivated until
I spoke to a man yesterday who is specialized in putting rigs together and he didn’t understand my choice ! and said a Flat 6 was better with Microcopter ! I have been
thinking about this for the last 24h and have decided to ignored his advice as I think he is just used to microcopter and flat systems but he did make me wonder about going
for a flat 6 as it always seems simpler to set up. Your experience conforts my decision. I have been thinking of going for the new DJI A2 but I am not sure it is quiet stable yet !


Did you have any trouble in setting / building it?


Thanks again for your help.


Gary

 

[garyl]

Skyjib x4

Thank you Steve. That is very useful. I like the idea of the XM-X4. I think I will follow your advice on the Wookong and strange coincidence I am Audi too ! I am going to start building after xmas so you will certainly here back from me !
Gary

No Problem.

It's the same everywhere, you get a guy who dives an Audi will usually try and tell you you should get and Audi vs BMW... the same with DJI vs Microkopter.

I think that no FC system is bomb proof, what your making is an uneducated guess... in my experience DJI works BUT, and it's a big but, you need to test, then test and then test again...

One of the reasons I'm building an XM-X4 test rig http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?15547-New-XM-X4-Build is because I want to be able to test firmware upgrades and prop combos down at my
local flying field and be satisfied that everything works as it should do before implementing the changes on my £10k SkyJib

As to the A2, Dave/Boris or somebody else needs to chime in here because I don't have any experience of it. However what I have read so far has put me off taking the plunge...

Remember that you can get a good deal on the WK-m promotions running at the moment http://www.buildyourowndrone.co.uk/DJI-Wookong-M-Promotion-p/dji-wookong-promotion.htm

No problems setting/building it, thanks to this forum, the Encyclopedia of Multi Rotors

BTW I drive an Audi...

 

[baja-king]

Just got our cut foam inserts back from the workshop...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[garyl]

Hi Steve,

That looks really nice ! Where did you have that done? I must thank you for your advice as it helped me make my decision. I have just finished building my SKYJIB X4 frame and waiting for the electronics !

Best regards
Gary
Attached is a picture.

Just got our cut foam inserts back from the workshop...

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk