SkyJib Octocopter for Filmmaking with RED Epic

R_Lefebvre

Arducopter Developer
You don't have to have experience reading reviews and discussions about RAID controllers and server components to select a rather well working setup. But you should know for sure what you do when building it all together and especially configuring it in an environment where data security is crucial:tennis: Anyway what I want to say is that I have the time (or rather my time is cheaper) to do the research, the others don't, so I do as much work as possible before handing it over.

Yes, but you're not building a server. What you want to do is more like performing surgery than building a computer.

When you build a computer, you buy components which are intended to fit together. You won't be trying to stuff a USB connector into an RJ45 jack. You don't have to solder anything. And computer technology is MUCH more mature, with a greater wealth and variety of knowledge to draw from than MR's. And building a server doesn't involve any hand-eye coordination. Your server won't move, or vibrate, and if it BSODs, it probably won't explode.
 

Did this happened to you? And are you sure problem is only with SimonK firmware? And which version? Pancake motors should be fine running these days with simonk firmware, but problems may occur not only with flashed escs.

Redridinghood: Can you please tell more what reliability issues you are talking to? "More likely to fail"? are you serious? I have never had a single issue with simonk flashed escs, and i have been running 6 sets of them with different brand esc:s in different builds. Neither i have heard any issues with others if just used with commonly used HK blueseries or F-30A/F-40A ones. I have only had problems with esc brands own firmwares like with maytechs, but after flashing they have been working flawlessly too.

Go ask Simon himself. I did, and this is his words. I am tired of people being rude and aggressive defending cheap electronics. I will refrain from passing down info in the future.

Gentlemen, goodnight and goodluck.
 

You don't have to have experience to select a rather well working setup.

on multirotors every single part is crucial..exchange one thing (hardware or software) and your result can turn to "not useful"...and it surprises me again and again me how many thing you have to watch out for
I personally dont know any Pilot or any company that would let anybody simply pick hardware that they have to build and fly afterwards
good luck though!
 

Did this happened to you? And are you sure problem is only with SimonK firmware? And which version? Pancake motors should be fine running these days with simonk firmware, but problems may occur not only with flashed escs.

yes it happened to me on different setups
especially on a tiger 3506...yes this motor is in genral a bad design in terms of timing loss ...but the flashing can make it worse simply because you change speed faster
changed to the new simonk code and it worked great...still dont trust this motor 100%
but in general flashed esc are a great thing...just not with on every motor out there I think
 

Kari

Member
Go ask Simon himself. I did, and this is his words. I am tired of people being rude and aggressive defending cheap electronics. I will refrain from passing down info in the future.

Gentlemen, goodnight and goodluck.

Didn't ment to be rude, but it's just not so simple that paying more you get necessarily more reliable stuff. What we have seen last months? For example we remember some time ago the few Skyjibs with with Aerodrive/Plettenberg crashing one after another. They should have been Rolls Royces of the multi-rotors but was found out to be a not reliable combo at all. We can see these flashed cheapo chinese used everywhere in all kind of setups with great success. I have been following Simons thread intensively and of course there is a lot experimental testing that is not always successful, but we also know firmware/software combinations which work and which are reliable. I do also have a set of Castle esc:s because i want to believe i can get better products spending some more money but i'm having issues with them too with latest mr firmware. Last time i tried them with naza, and i had no success to arm two of them at all since they had been working fine some time earlier, in same setup. So i replaced them with flashed F-30A:s which worked like charm again. I'm just tired of spending my money to "high end" stuff which appears not to work any better nor any more reliable than cheap chinese products.
 

I am a huge fun of reflashed esc. My point was that if you intend of lifting 30k gear maybe you should get more robust equipment.
 

Kari

Member
yes it happened to me on different setups
especially on a tiger 3506...yes this motor is in genral a bad design in terms of timing loss ...but the flashing can make it worse simply because you change speed faster
changed to the new simonk code and it worked great...still dont trust this motor 100%
but in general flashed esc are a great thing...just not with on every motor out there I think

I don't have any personal experience with these motors but i remember to read that there were issues even with T-motors own esc:s. So that's not probably easy to make these motors work properly. With latest versions also they should be playing ok together though. Of course there will be non working combinations when there comes new type or generation of motors to markets. SimonK is doing amazingly huge and restless charity work all the time, just for we can get more out of our multis.

That's why if used for serious filming should be stuck on motor and esc/firmware combinations that's are known to play together.
 

R_Lefebvre

Arducopter Developer
Go ask Simon himself. I did, and this is his words. I am tired of people being rude and aggressive defending cheap electronics. I will refrain from passing down info in the future.

Gentlemen, goodnight and goodluck.

Sorry, but I've never seen a request for evidence to support a supposition as being considered "rude and aggressive". I find it's actually the supporters of high-priced stuff being rude and aggressive as they strive to justify their expense.

All I want is the data.

I don't doubt for a second that the SimonK firmware can lose sync with low kV motors. There are plenty of reports of that. But I don't have low kV motors, so I'm trying to figure out if there are any other problems I have to worry about.
 

Kari

Member
I am a huge fun of reflashed esc. My point was that if you intend of lifting 30k gear maybe you should get more robust equipment.

100% agree but it's just crazy that we are not necessarily getting more robust or reliable stuff even if we spend 100X money.
 

nicwilke

Active Member
If you want to get into the market, buy some affordable hardware, and get to work learning how to build and fly. The job will get done when you have learned enough to do it. But buying expensive hardware, expecting to be able to deliver a product on a deadline is doomed to failure. It's like the script from so many reality TV shows. <dun dun="" dunnnnn=""> "Will they solve the problem before the deadline? Find out, after the break!"

Perfect advice, and I was thinking the same. $4000 budget would get you into a smaller craft, capable of lifting a smaller camera. You can mix and match the aerial footage, just hand it over to post, and tell them to work their magic... LOL. I started with an Xaircraft X8 coaxial, it was terrible, but so was I. Then progressed the hardware over to a hexa frame, and became addicted to this... Then purchased better props, better motors, and worked along that path. Then got a decent mid range frame (second hand), and followed by a gimbal. Now, I'm back onto a hexa, as I only need to lift small cameras, up to DSLR, but if needed can lift a few KG camera with some modifications. I think you'd enjoy a smaller craft more, and also get yourself some simulator, like aero sim (As it has simulation of aerial camera from a gimbal). I did about 40 hours flight training on a simulator, and saved over $100,000 in crashes, LOL.

BTW, I know the difference between renting and buying, I'm not sure what you meant by that. Please, I'm not knocking you, you're on the rite track, asking the rite people, in the rite place.

</dun>
 

R_Lefebvre

Arducopter Developer
Fact is, this thread is one of many which go down the exact same path. Aspiring film makers wants to fast track and buy his way to success. We should compile all of them into a post and just direct people there. Save a lot of time and aggravation.

Have we ever seen one of these come back with a: "to all the naysayers, check out this awesome video I shot!" I haven't seen it yet.
 

DCDK

Member
The offers from some vendors finally arrived. I'll order the items tomorrow. Wish me luck! I'll need it
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Thank you all (well most of you) for the support you have given.


Cheers

David



PS: That's the final list of items I want to order:



Freefly Cinestar8 kit w/ 500mm booms
CS Camera Mount Red Epic 3 axis
Freefly Radian 3 Axis
8x KW Pro 10 Motor
4x XOAR 8 to 6 mm adapter
4x XOAR 15x5" wooden props
HoverflyPRO Blackboard
MX-20 12-Kanal Gr. HoTT
MX-12 9-Kanal Gr. HoTT
Graupner ULTRA DUO PLUS 60
2x Copter Deluxe UBEC 4A mit 5V/6V
8x TURNIGY Plush 60amp Speed Controller
6x Turnigy nano-tech 8000mAh 6S 25~50C
4x Turnigy nano-tech 2200mah 3S 25~50C
 
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DCDK

Member
Also want to see how this will progress, build and then video clips.

Hi Lanzar,

what ESC would you recommend for the KW Pro 10 motors? Plush 40A? Plush 60A? Castle Lite 50? Maytech 40A? Maytech 60A? KW60E? An ESC with a simonK firmware? There are so many options and everyone has a different opinion on them. Of course I would like to get a Herkules III, but that's unfortunately not in my budget.

Cheers
David
 


Ray Bahas

Member
Well, that's the best you could have as advise DCDK (see quote)
Beware of vendors pretending to know it all, they don't ! They just sell you what convenient for them but they have no idea about the real production field and contingencies. I learnt it to my own expense.
Do serious researches among pro or experienced USERS and just forget about vendors promoting their stuff in forums.

redridinghood; [COLOR=#ff0000 said:
 

BorisS

Drone Enthusiast
Ray Bahas,

the truth is not black or white in this case. You have some vendors that actually fly there stuff and setups, with the actual components they sell and promote, and they take the same risks we do and produce good and professional footage !

But yes on the other side many times vendors get new developed components the same time as their customers do or even after them and search themselves for answer in forum like these. Which again is completly acceptable. Most dangerous is a i know it all character putting others at risk.

Boris
 

Ray Bahas

Member
I surely agree with you Boris, but let's get on with the fact that public forums are intended for novice mostly. And more than often, the member gets into it to acquire honest and true advise about their queries (like me). He's not always aware of some misleading comments issued with mean interest. My point is, check the experience, proof and liability of any intervening member before making your mind. I welcome most of all vendors who actually test and publish the results of their work.
Best,
Ray
 

Lanzar

Member
We tested with maytech 60 and KW60e. They work with both and temperatures were good. On maytech temps would go up to 60 when it was realy hot and sunny but that is still ok.
We did not test castle light and plush but i am almost shure 40 amps is not enough iff you fly on a hot day and you have a lot off payload.



Hi Lanzar,

what ESC would you recommend for the KW Pro 10 motors? Plush 40A? Plush 60A? Castle Lite 50? Maytech 40A? Maytech 60A? KW60E? An ESC with a simonK firmware? There are so many options and everyone has a different opinion on them. Of course I would like to get a Herkules III, but that's unfortunately not in my budget.

Cheers
David
 

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