Sony NEX-5

[Bartman]

Mombasa,
You might want to consider swapping to a smaller diameter prop when you swap to a significantly lighter camera on the same airframe. It'll take some of the bounce out of the flight characteristics.
What motors/props are you running with the 5D?
Thanks,
Bart

 

[DennyR]

I got one! Love it. but it does not have video out. Pics are amazing and it shoots RAW. I use a 16mm lens although I got the kit with the 18/55 but not used it yet. I also have a Panasonic Lumix TZ10 which is amazing video and would say its better than the Nex5 for video BUT there is no way of triggering it for taking pictures. I use the Gentled led to trigger the Nex5. Recce2 has written a instruction manual for setting it up. Ill try and find it ans post it up or send the link.

Out you want to know just ask

Dave It is hackable under the button. I love my little TZ10

 

[MombasaFlash]

Mombasa,
You might want to consider swapping to a smaller diameter prop when you swap to a significantly lighter camera on the same airframe. It'll take some of the bounce out of the flight characteristics.
What motors/props are you running with the 5D?
Thanks,
Bart

AXI 2814/22's with APC 12/3.8 props.



So here we have two relatively similar flight paths for a direct comparison between the two cameras. The purpose is mainly to establish whether or not the NEX-5n can be a sufficiently serious alternative to the well established, proven video quality of the 5D mk2.

The NEX is considerably lighter than the 5D and therefore carries the bonus of additional flight time and cooler operating temperatures. The downside for the NEX is that its reduced mass has less physical stabilising effect on the AD-8 itself in flight.

The first split screen shows essentially raw footage. There is some processing to remove distractions - colour balance has been modified to ameliorate the changes with the advancing sunset so that the two images are relatively similar in that respect, and the Canon's image has been zoomed in so that focal length is more or less similar with the two cameras. This will of course detract from the 5D's resolution slightly.

The four-screen split shows the same 'raw' footage at the top and with post-stabilisation to both files at the bottom.

This whole exercise is just for my benefit but it is fun to pass it on - and even more fun to make a game of it. For that reason I am not going to say which camera is which - yet. :highly_amused:

 

[Bartman]

MBF
Try the 11x5 Graupners with the NEX on your Okto. You've got a lot of lift for such a light weight. Or you could try adding two more batteries and extend your flight times.
Also, you might getter better flight times with 13 or 14" props and the 5D. With the 12x3.8 APC's the motors are probably at their rotational limit just to carry the weight. I'd guess Xoar 13x5 or 14x5 (PJN electric) would help. I tried the APC 12x3.8 props with my Okto and T2i and I wasn't happy at all even though I flew it like that for a couple of months because I had work to do and couldn't get the Xoar props delivered quickly enough.
Keep the camera comparisons coming. I saw a friend's NEX photos and the 16mm just didn't look wide enough compared to my T2i with the 10-20 wide angle.
Thanks,
Bart

 

[ghaynes]

MBF Great comparison but since it isn't in HD they look just about the same to my eye in Vimeo standard. I did see a difference in your earlier post. The 5D was sharper. Noticed it the most as you flew over your van and reading the lettering on the side.

Gary

 

[MombasaFlash]

MBF
Try the 11x5 Graupners with the NEX on your Okto. You've got a lot of lift for such a light weight. Or you could try adding two more batteries and extend your flight times.
Also, you might getter better flight times with 13 or 14" props and the 5D. With the 12x3.8 APC's the motors are probably at their rotational limit just to carry the weight. I'd guess Xoar 13x5 or 14x5 (PJN electric) would help. I tried the APC 12x3.8 props with my Okto and T2i and I wasn't happy at all even though I flew it like that for a couple of months because I had work to do and couldn't get the Xoar props delivered quickly enough.
Keep the camera comparisons coming. I saw a friend's NEX photos and the 16mm just didn't look wide enough compared to my T2i with the 10-20 wide angle.
Thanks,
Bart

12" props are as big as I can use without changing all the booms. At the time I bought the AD-8, Droidworx was apparently in some sort of godalmighty mess and their dealers were displaying all the wrong stuff and even Droidworx's spec sheet was wrong. I ordered 12" and 13" props and then found out that the 13" would not fit. Altigator charged me a restocking fee, even though the error had been Droidworx's incorrect published info. Then I found out that Droidworx had increased the standard boom length in order to cater for 13" props. They did offer to change my booms but by this time I had already cut the motor cables.

Anyway, I decided to persevere with the 410 booms because they were already ungainly and awkward enough. Who else out there gets backache leaning over the props and booms to reach the middle? I actually like the 12/3.8 props for their shallow pitch and relative indestructibility, but I might try those Graupners one day.

Fortunately, due to the 12" limit the Zoar's are not available to me so I don't have to agonize over paying that ridiculous price.

Did your friend have his NEX set to 4:3 or 16:9? Personally, I find the 16mm lens quite wide enough. I just don't like the shaded corners and it is missing the OIS of the 18-55. Also, as I have mentioned before somewhere, the super-wide aerial view is getting a bit tired, particularly when it comes with GoPro barrelling and views of the front boom and motor.

 

[Macsgrafs]

5D on the right...2 things immediately stand out for me (yes Im a canon man). 1 is the colour, far richer on the 5D & No.2 is its more steady...more weight.

I think there is only one fair way to judge the quality....thats make the mount the same weight when using the NEX as it is when using the 5D, that should sort out the vibration issues etc. Then film BOTH on the same quality..example full HD at 1920 x 1080, then shrink each down using identical settings in your NLE programe.

Ross

 

[MombasaFlash]

5D on the right...2 things immediately stand out for me (yes Im a canon man). 1 is the colour, far richer on the 5D & No.2 is its more steady...more weight.

I think there is only one fair way to judge the quality....thats make the mount the same weight when using the NEX as it is when using the 5D, that should sort out the vibration issues etc. Then film BOTH on the same quality..example full HD at 1920 x 1080, then shrink each down using identical settings in your NLE programe.

Ross

There are not actually any major vibration issues. Adding weight to the NEX setup is fine for fairness in these comparison tests but otherwise it defeats the object. May as well just stick with the 5D. Both cameras were recording at 1920 x 1080p25 for these tests and the files were treated identically in FCP - other than balancing the colour and focal length.

Sunset was fast approaching so one of them had a very orange tint and the 5D's slightly wider lens gives it an advantage in terms of perceived stability and resolution. Both would be a distraction for this comparison. Well, that's the theory anyway.

This is not to try and prove the NEX is better. It isn't. I just want to satisfy myself that the NEX can be useful.

 

[Droider]

I just want to satisfy myself that the NEX can be useful.

And in your professional opinion for the lesser mortals on here that dont have a budget that will build a MR capable of the 5D or in fact purchase a 5D is the Nex5 and a lighter cheaper build a good option for the lower budget builders..?

I think its a great little camera..

Dave

 

[ghaynes]

As to the quality of the image I got a buddy to send me a couple of RAW files from his NEX5. Ran them through LightRoom3, took them in to Photoshop CS5 and resized to 62" on the long side (reason for so big is I am geeing into MR to take my landscape photography to a new height ). Printed a section out at 12x18 inches. One with no further sharpening and one with Nik Sharpener Pro. The photo was of a brick lighthouse and is incredibly sharp and sellable weven at a finished size of 60x20. Noise was extremely low and overall a spectacular image from a 14mp camera. So I'm probably going to bite on a NEX-7 when they come out and use that for the aerial work since flying my digital Hasselblad 39mp requires a leap in MR size since it is nearly 3kg. (for the photographer buffs the prints I made were on my Epson 9900 using an ImagePrint 8 RIP and printed on Epson Exhibition Fibre).

 

[MombasaFlash]

And in your professional opinion for the lesser mortals on here that dont have a budget that will build a MR capable of the 5D or in fact purchase a 5D is the Nex5 and a lighter cheaper build a good option for the lower budget builders..?

I think its a great little camera..

Dave

I think it is a great little camera too, with the proviso that the lenses could be better. The 5D is an accepted benchmark and was originally purchased to be carried around by the big gasser heli. Then MR's came along and they get into the sky with a lot less fuss. But there is a price to pay, centered around payload. So, whilst this otherwise bog-standard AD-8 can lift the 5D I am keen to find a worthy, but lighter substitute.

Raw video from the Canon 5D looks incredible (despite all the negatives concerning DSLR video that most people cannot even see), whereas I have found that raw video from the NEX-5n is rather soft and requires a degree of sharpening for it to look truly HD. The Go-Pro raw video on the other hand looks incredible, but it goes to the bottom of the class as a result of compression artifacts.

What makes all of this a bit of a joke is that the first (relatively) cheapo, even boggier-standard MK Octo with its flimsy HiSight III camera mount is only man enough to carry the Pentax Optio S-12. When taking photos of a local Radisson hotel that MK Octo was used for a pre-shoot to determine angles and the photos it produced with the Optio were barely distinguishable from those of the 5D which was carried by the big gasser for the actual job.

These are completely untreated, direct from the camera images.

Pentax Optio S-12:

Canon 5D:

 

[Macsgrafs]

There are not actually any major vibration issues. Adding weight to the NEX setup is fine for fairness in these comparison tests but otherwise it defeats the object. May as well just stick with the 5D. Both cameras were recording at 1920 x 1080p25 for these tests and the files were treated identically in FCP - other than balancing the colour and focal length.

Sunset was fast approaching so one of them had a very orange tint and the 5D's slightly wider lens gives it an advantage in terms of perceived stability and resolution. Both would be a distraction for this comparison. Well, that's the theory anyway.

This is not to try and prove the NEX is better. It isn't. I just want to satisfy myself that the NEX can be useful.

Sorry my mistake, I didnt mean real virbation..I meant jerkiness! Yes the weight addition was purely as a test, but if you need extra weight it shows that it isnt much cop for aerial work, because without the weight it will be jerky & unnaceptable to a potential customer.
As soon as you adjusted the raw footage to get the same focal length, then you have changed the test conditions & any comparision will be flawed.

 

[MombasaFlash]

... As soon as you adjusted the raw footage to get the same focal length, then you have changed the test conditions & any comparision will be flawed.

Quite so. It would have been cleverer to have thought ahead and adjusted the zoom on the 5D to match the NEX lens. Didn't think about it at the field. Duh. The Canon still comes out noticeably sharper though.

What do you think about those two photos before with the major league 5D and the less than minor Optio? Food for thought there.

The smaller MK Octo is definitely not a video tool - certainly not until it gets a better camera mount - but as a photo platform with the lowly Optio it is a real contender for light duty work. It is light, makes hardly a sound once it is in the air, is remarkably stationary in GPS hold and stays up there for 15 minutes without any fuss. The AD-8 sounds like several swarms of bees (actually it makes me think of Lancaster bombers with the multiple props producing a droning, chorus effect), is not nearly so steady in GPS hold and has incurred all these threads about temperatures, flight times, weight etc.

But then, that is video. It is a whole different and much, much bigger set of challenges.

 

[Bartman]

MBF,
It looks like you had more light in the first picture but it also looks like the lake had ripples on it in the second picture which didn't allow for the same kinds of reflections that really make the first picture so pretty.
Would you mind posting the width of the 5D please? I'd like to see if it will fit onto my camera mount.
Thanks,
Bart

 

[Macsgrafs]

Quite so. It would have been cleverer to have thought ahead and adjusted the zoom on the 5D to match the NEX lens. Didn't think about it at the field. Duh. The Canon still comes out noticeably sharper though.

What do you think about those two photos before with the major league 5D and the less than minor Optio? Food for thought there.

The smaller MK Octo is definitely not a video tool - certainly not until it gets a better camera mount - but as a photo platform with the lowly Optio it is a real contender for light duty work. It is light, makes hardly a sound once it is in the air, is remarkably stationary in GPS hold and stays up there for 15 minutes without any fuss. The AD-8 sounds like several swarms of bees (actually it makes me think of Lancaster bombers with the multiple props producing a droning, chorus effect), is not nearly so steady in GPS hold and has incurred all these threads about temperatures, flight times, weight etc.

But then, that is video. It is a whole different and much, much bigger set of challenges.

The smaller camera has good comparison with the 5D, but as you rightly said...video is a whole new ball game & requires different conditions to acheive similar results to still photographs.

Regards
Ross

 

[Macsgrafs]

MBF,
It looks like you had more light in the first picture but it also looks like the lake had ripples on it in the second picture which didn't allow for the same kinds of reflections that really make the first picture so pretty.
Would you mind posting the width of the 5D please? I'd like to see if it will fit onto my camera mount.
Thanks,
Bart

Bart here's the dimensions:- 152 x 113.5 x 75 (wxhxd)

 

[MombasaFlash]

MBF,
It looks like you had more light in the first picture but it also looks like the lake had ripples on it in the second picture which didn't allow for the same kinds of reflections that really make the first picture so pretty.
Would you mind posting the width of the 5D please? I'd like to see if it will fit onto my camera mount.
Thanks,
Bart

The two photos were taken on different days. As I recall the first from the pre-shoot with the MK Octo/Pentax Optio S-12 was on a Saturday and the second from the shoot proper with the 5D and 'Sally' (that's the name of the big gasser heli) was the following Monday.

The 5D body measures 152w x 113.5h x 75d (mm). The MK HiSight SLR2 is advertised as being suitable for the Canon 5D mk2. Yes it fits, but the provided fixing slots are way too far forward to achieve anything close to longitudinal balance. This is with the standard 24-105mm zoom but as ANY L series lens is approximately the same weight using another lens would not help, unless you go for a cheaper one. I drilled a new fixing hole so that it achieves balance but then the camera sits too far back to clear the top of the mount for 90° vertical use. It can reach about 60-70° before it strikes the stupidly positioned Roll servo bracket.

 

[DennyR]

FWIW I have found the video quality of the Panasonic HDC-TM 900 to be better than the 5D and it is a huge weight/cost saving but it is sensitive to vibration. If you know how to deal with that then it is a better choice. I often expand mine to 2K.
For the average enthusiast who just wants to get some reasonable quality footage and stills then the 5D is male jewelry. 550D is a better choice. When the day comes along when your treasured MR whatever decides to do a drop kick bang smash as it tries to transit through cumula granite, as they nearly all do eventually, then you may be glad you went for a cheaper option. My 2 cents worth.

 

[MombasaFlash]

That's why I bought the NEX. I want as lightweight kg with heavyweight imaging as possible for the MR.

I would prefer to leave the 'jewellery' on the gasser along with the DVCPRO HD video camera.

 

[DennyR]

Good idea:tennis: