Shall I get rid of Manual Mode?

[hover.ch]

I'm using my MR for aerial imaging only, no sports flying whatsoever. After some 20 flights I come to the conclusion that I'm going to reprogram my Tx so that there is no MANUAL MODE (switch position) anymore. I actually never used it, but more than once, I switched to manual inadvertently.

Do you now of any reason not to do this?

 

[olof]

That is what I did. After a hard landing when I switched to manual and the S800 dropped like a rock on 50% throttle, it was completely my fault I could not add throttle fast enough, I was only 6' up above the hard driveway. I broke 2 arms and a part of the Zenmuse cracked, both easily fixed.

The only reason to keep manual would be if something goes wrong with the auto pilot. So in my opinion there is no reason to keep manual on the same switch as ATTI/GPS. Others will disagree I am sure.

 

[Bison52]

To enter compass calibration, you rapidly move the mode switch from position 1 to position 3, which is normally manual. I don't know if position 3 must be manual for this to work, haven't tried to check it out. That's the only possible drawback I can think of.

 

[hover.ch]

Almost the same happedned to me today - the MR dropped and I could hardly add enough throttle to not letting it touch the ground.

As far as I'm aware of, the same sensors are used for Atti and Manual mode, right? Even in Manual mode there is a minimal level of stabilization, I assume. It would be impossible to directly control the thrust (motors), I 'm pretty sure. Having said that, I wouldn't sacrifice a lot in terms of safety / degradation capabilities. Right?

 

[hover.ch]

To enter compass calibration, you rapidly move the mode switch from position 1 to position 3, which is normally manual. I don't know if position 3 must be manual for this to work, haven't tried to check it out. That's the only possible drawback I can think of.

Good point, Bison52, thanks for mentioning.

 

[kloner]

When that dropping is going on it means your not propped anywhere near right. You want the stick to be +-5% to center in manual. Then if that's what you got and its still dropping you want to go back into Rx Cali in assistant, run calibrate against and make sure throttle is at exactly 50% when you hit finish.

Manual mode is the only way I've seen a flyaway get stopped while it was happening, fell like a rock but it was gonna anyways

 

[hover.ch]

Manual mode is the only way I've seen a flyaway get stopped while it was happening, fell like a rock but it was gonna anyways

What do you mean by "flyaway"? In what state was it flying away, Atti? GPS/Atti? Waypoint-mode controlled by GS?

 

[kloner]

When a dji controller gets a vib induced whatever it is happens, manual gives it back to you. I've seen em in atti and GPS modes. With small stock motors it takes quite a vibe like hello city in a hero. When you run big motors like 28mm or more those vibes can be a lot more into the imu from more weight. Something as small as a slightly out of balance prop or a bearing race going away not showing jello will just get a mind of its own, pitch a direction and rise on out. Even with throttle all the way down, however the one I saw go and the guy hit manual it idled to the ground. Hang around dji forums enough you'll start seeing it. Loose dangling wires hitting the imu can do it too

 

[VINHEX]

I've never needed to do this but what about if fail-safe kicks in and you want to gain back control.. Do you know have to switch into manual and then back into GPS to gain control again.. Just a thought as said never had to use it..

 

[hover.ch]

I've never needed to do this but what about if fail-safe kicks in and you want to gain back control.. Do you know have to switch into manual and then back into GPS to gain control again.. Just a thought as said never had to use it..

I think (I have tried) to escape from fail-safe by switching to Atti (not necessarily manual) and, if needed, back to GPS/Atti.
Although the WKM user manual sometimes explicitly mentions "Manual" mode, I haven't found a case where switching to Atti wouldn't do (the same) job. Maybe except for compass calibration, but that's not an in-flight action (I hope).

But I will double-check, thanks for the hint!

 

[DucktileMedia]

All I can add is that my friend has a wookong, he is a VERY advanced and capable pilot. He accidentally flipped into manual mode when leaning down to check the camera status and the heli started to get really funky in the air and crash.

 

[gtranquilla]

Someone posted c/w video the loss of two props in the air on a Y6 or X8 was only able to land it safely using manual mode. The WKM was able to regain flying mode but wasn't good enough in Attitude or GPS mode to work it out for safe landing. I'll see if I can find that item.

 

[FerdinandK]

I am not sure why people here are mystifying the manual-mode of the WKM, it is just a "rate mode" like with the "old" kk-board, so only gyros are active. I find it pretty smooth and convenient to fly, it is not evil, it is not funky, it has nothing to do with magic. If you want to descent (really) fast, there is only the option to switch into manual mode and put the copter "nose-down". If you lost a prop (or two) the copter becomes "drift" in Atti and GPS-Atti. The better the copter is powered, the less the drift, but the "rate-mode" (=manual mode) is still working as it should. You also have more power-reserves in manual mode (full throttle in manual mode is full throttle on the escs). You can also use the manual mode just for fun (I am not sure it is allowed to have fun only).

Here an old video most of the time flown in manual-mode:

Here the video where I lost the two motor-bells (it is the same copter as above, only pimped to a X12)

best regards

Ferdinand

 

[hover.ch]

Thanks a lot for all the valuable input!

I've decided to keep manual mode - just in case. But I will reassign my Tx switches nevertheless.

Instead of a 3-way switch directly assigned to WKM's control mode (Manual - Atti - GPS/Atti) I will assign a 2-way switch to 2 logical flight modes: TAKEOFF and POSITION HOLD.
- TAKEOFF (maps to WKM.Atti) is used for take-off and landing, a flight mode where I want to have direct control but still want rely on WKM's Atti control mode.
- POSITION HOLD (maps to WKM.GPS/Atti) is used as a normal flight mode (for aerial imaging).

But the flight modes have even more functionality:
- TAKEOFF will override the IOC switch and always disable IOC. During take-off and landing I don't want to have the mag compass in the control loop.
- TAKEOFF will also use a linear throttle "curve" while POSITION HOLD uses a point curve with a horizontal step around neutral. That allows me to easily keep altitude even if throttle stick is not exactly neutral. Of course such a non-linear throttle curve is not well suited for start and landing.

In case I will get into deep troubles, I will use a separate switch to either switch to
- MANUAL (to get direct control) or
- FAIL-SAFE (to force WKM to switch to coming-home and landing mode).

 

[FerdinandK]

@hover.ch
I am not that skilled pilot as many here are, but I would recommend to keep it simple.

The less switches, the better, what you describe above, is a bit complicated, since all your logical steps, you have to know in emergency case, and you have to train all of them.
You have to be able to use all switches without looking at the rc-transmitter, and without thinking. If this is not the case right now, you have to exercise that as long as you can apply them blindly.
The IOC is a nice feature, it is nice to have, but the better approach would be to practice to fly "nose in", and to practice that in manual mode (but possibly not on an Drwxs AD-8). If you can do so there is no longer a need for an IOC.
Also your ideas around the throttle-curves, I would strongly doubt, the better thing is just to practice how to apply throttle. There will always be a situation, where alt-hold is not as precise as you wish, in this case you are not able to react, or you have to think first what "throttle-curve" is currently active, and how to get the right one.

Keep it simple (as simple as possible), one 3-way switch for Flight-Modes, and a 2-way switch to activate failsave is enough. If you can handle this blindly and in all situation you can imagine, you can step foreward and activate a second 3-point switch to go for POI (the IOC I would not use). I am still not using IOC or POI, this can all be flown "by hand".

best regards

Ferdinand

 

[hover.ch]

Keep it simple is always a good idea, I fully agree. Although it sounds weird maybe, it is actually what I want to do.

My TAKEOFF mode is a one switch position, making sure, that I'm in proper control for landing/takeoff. It happened to me many months ago, using MK electronics, when I forgot to switch off IOC (MK calls it care-free). I was making a 90° turn shortly before landing and suddenly care-free became a nightmare because nose-in was no longer nose-in. The MR finally crahsed because I was in the wrong IOC mode. That was when I introduced the TAKEOFF mode and it worked well, for many months. Now that I switched to WKM, I tried to stick to WKM's "simple" 2 switch approach but I think it's more complicated.

For aerial filming IOC is a very valuable feature although one can do everything by hand almost anytime.
I do want to use it.

The throttle curve setting is a different story. I find it very difficult to keep throttle stick position exactly neutral while yaw'ing (with the same stick). This often results in a unwanted climb/descent (while filming). The step in the throttle curve makes it a little more forgiving, that's all.

But nevertheless I completely agree with "KISS" - keep it simple and stupid is often the best approach!
Thank you for your valuable feedback.

 

[Benchmark]

You can get out of fail safe mode by flicking from GPS to Atti and back, you do not need to go to manual.

 

[hover.ch]

You can get out of fail safe mode by flicking from GPS to Atti and back, you do not need to go to manual.

Yeap, that works.

 

[jetbootz]

I have the same thoughts. I do not want manual available during flight. flicking to manual by mistake = most likely crash. so I have done some testing this morning.
if you configure the end point of the channelso that you get GPS - ATTI - Failsafe for the T8FG it would read

38 100 100 78

now when I did this and attempted to calibrate compass it does not go into calbration mode. therefore part of my preflight checklist is to

change channel end point to

78 100 100 78

then calibrate compass

then change back to

38 100 100 78

this will give GPS ATTI FS on the 3 pos switch I use, and gps will be the closest to me, with FS all the way forward.

hope that helps

 

[hover.ch]

Thanks for the post.

I have decided to use real flight modes, i.e., different Futaba flight conditions. By using Futaba's AFR functionality I can define linear, expo or point curves for each channel per flight mode. That makes it pretty easy to change the behavior of a single switch depending on the flight mode.

To make things clear: I'm trying to simplify and not to make it as sophisticated as possible.

I have now
- one standard 2-way switch allowing me to choose either TAKEOFF (Atti) or CRUISE (GPS/Atti) flight mode
- one 3-way switch for IOC allowing to choose between normal/off - POI and HomeLock, ONLY ACTIVE in CRUISE mode
- one emergency switch allowing to enforce MANUAL or FAILSAFE (ignoring all the other switches)

That's all. I have double-checked every function with WKM assistent. I will give it a try tomorrow.