SkyJib/AeroDrive 8 Crash Video

[DKTek]

Here's the set up as flown:

-SkyJib 8 with retracts, AeroDrive 8, Pletty 15-20's, APC 14x4.7 props, MK GPS 2.1 with shield, MK NAV 2.0, MK FC ME 2.1, Fut 14MZ with MK modded R6203SB receiver, 4- parallel Gens Ace 5S 5300 30C (21.2ah) Lipo's.
-AV200/360 Pro with; JR11x and R1221/2.4 receiver, PicLoc3X Pro, FlightPower EVO Lite 4S 2500 28C Lipo, Range Video filtered 12v reg for 900mhz video tx and video switcher, UBec 7.2v reg for servo's, Recom 5v reg for cam controllers(Blip Switch Duo and GentLED type 40), Canon 5D Mk 2 with Sigma 12-24mm 1:4.5-5.6 DG lens.

All devices running current firmware...

We are still in our test phase and this day we did our first flight with gimbal and camera running with downlink. This was to be the second 10 minute flight of the day. The first was without incident. My partner has a hand held FLIR and the temps appeared to be fine and the AeroDrive seemed within reason... After takeoff, Alt. hold was activated then POS Hold. The SJ8 drifted left so I turned off the POS Hold. That's when the SJ8 climbed slightly and the motors started screeching and lost power. It fell, almost flat, about 7 ft onto some thick and cushy grass. The gear bent under and the AV200's roll frame collapsed. The Jib was not harmed and lucky for me, the Canon and lens are fine too. Here's the raw footage from the 5D...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2ClIoKGBiA

The after crash inspection... We were expecting to see maybe an I2C failure of some sort in MK toolz. When bench power was added to the SJ8, the motors did not initialize, arm, or make any sounds. MK Toolz shows no errors and report the BL temps at 30 for the first 8 and 0 for 9-12. Page 13 shows 0, no errors. There is NO smell of any kind coming from the AeroDrive....

What the AeroDrive does do is this,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=495KlUBp7G0&list=UULymDatinRKRpvQ27mYaEpg&index=1&feature=plcp

Anyone know what may have happened? We cannot find any information in the form of a Product Manual. Those typically have troubleshooting pages that would list the light sequences fault conditions.

 

[Aerial Media Pros]

Do those Plety's have prop adapters on them? If so, are they tight? I have not used them before, but have seen set screws on other types of adapters come loose. When that happend, the adapter will spin on the motor shaft making a metal to metal screeching noise. Thats probably not it, but thought I would throw that out there.

 

[seattle_helo]

A real nice rig- that's a real shame to see this. Glad to hear the camera and most of the ship survived.

I know nothing about the AeroDrive so I'm stabbing in the dark but when I first started F'n around with MK gear I inadvertently knocked loose one of the surface mount components from a BL2 with a nut driver. It took a few days to figure out what I had done but the symptoms were somewhat similar to what you're seeing- no error reported in MK Tools for the affected ESC (odd since the ESC itself reports an error), flashing LED's on the ESC and a displayed ESC temp of 30° no matter what the actual component or ambient temp was. So perhaps in the case of the Aerodrive maybe one master component failed which effects the entire board downstream? Just a pure guess but based on the sounds those motors made going down it seems like the ESC board is the culprit. I wonder if the LED flashes on that AeroDrive use the same error codes as the stock MK ESC's?

 

[redridinghood]

I would suspect only the Aerodrive. Do you see any blown fets? What wire awg are you using to connect to the motors and what size capacitors are on the board?

 

[JLO]

Hi Dan sorry to hear that, do you recall what was the overall weight of the entire craft

 

[DKTek]

Thanks for the replies guys. I've been waiting to hear from AEROdron. It's a shame that I'm having to send AEROdron a second inquiry as to what's expected now. This is the most expensive controller out there, sold with NO manual or product support. It dies after only 12 minutes carrying a load that is common to it's use. This controller is advertised to work with the Pletty 15-20's. My config isn't out of the norm.

Here's another theory from a PM,

-since the unit is based on the MK BL-Ctrl 2.0, that an over current condition may have happened. Here's a quote,

I don't know the aerodrive board, but I want to let you know about a similar problem.
The BL-Ctrl. 2.0 have a problem in the current limitation. Normally it should be smooth, but with the Orbit 15-20 it is not working smooth. The Orbit 15-20 are very powerful and need much current for accelerating. So this motors can accelerate an propeller faster as other motors and this is fine for the stabilization. But he ESC stops this to fast and starts to fast again.

Seattle, I didn't find any evidence of missing parts but that is definitely a good suggestion. Although it crashed into a soft lawn, who knows what forces went through the board on impact.

Aerial Media Pros, yes they are the adapters sent with the Plettys. They are secure, as verified with the post crash inspection. Although, I am seeking a contact for Pletty as I hear they can modd the motors to use a regular prop mount(MK style) for around 25 Euro per motor. I wish they had done this from the beginning.

I haven't weighed the set up yet but it should be close to what the others weigh, flying with this config.

 

[achta]

atentione with this setup!!!

the pletenbergs 15-20 bring the BL Controll to cut off
please read this :

http://forum.mikrokopter.de/topic-post397806.html#post397806

its german but you will understand...

in Europe we are 3 different Companies with that setup, and the problem is every time the high peaks over 60A from the Orbit,
also when you give only little faster throttle the motor lets say is with 10-15 Ampere but the Peaks goe to over 40A up to 60A and make you BL Controll cut off and boom...
thats the sound befor the crash

thats with Aerodrive 8 and with BL.2.0...
the problem is this combination with Orbit will not work, only with, lat say 6-7 kg and slow flights but no break throttle :_)

its a software Problem and may be Holger will make a new software for this but i dont know...

so for now we have 29 psc of the Orbit, and leave them in the BOX....

we use now AXI and Kopterworx Motors and..... it works....

i know your feeling, sorry for that....

lg from Austria

 

[Munch]

Hope this helps:

http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?746-Pletternberg-motors&p=38106&viewfull=1#post38106

 

[DKTek]

View attachment 4309View attachment 4310View attachment 4311

Thought I'd add a few pics of the damage. This also, sort of, shows my gimbal layout and wiring efforts. Only the 5D Mk2 and batteries were removed ASAP.


I'd like to see the AEROdrive 8 replaced and a return/refund for the Pletty's at the very least from the dealer/manufacture...Sooner than later! I followed their advice, didn't mishandle the equipment, and have lost revenue.

New legs and an AV200 crash kit would be thoughtful too since this was not of my doing from improper use. The gimbal, retracts, and AeroDrive came from AEROdron. The Plettys came from Pano-Dirk.

Now, it's time to see what buying the most expensive equipment gets you in the service department. Question is, is it worth the expense and how much hassle will this be???

 

[Munch]

Well, don't bet on the German customer support, we have troubles since February, still no solution in sight. But Plettenberg said, that the Herkules v3 will work with the Orbit 15. What a bright ray of hope...

 

[JLO]

Lades and Gentleman the cat is out the bag in America this is call a Recall from the dealer and the manufacturer of the products painfull situation I hope for reputation sake they do the right thing I also have 8 Plettenberg 15-20 the decition to buy at the time was very similar as DKTek the idea at the time was how I can go wrong if I am buying the best of the best.
I have not fly yet I am on final stages of the build..now what..
What is going to happen to the motors ?
What am I going to replace them with ?
I have 2 Herkules boards MK electronics and a SkyJib 8

 

[DKTek]

But Plettenberg said, that the Herkules v3 will work with the Orbit 15. What a bright ray of hope...

That's what they said about the AEROdrive 8 as well and you see where that has led us too........ advance with caution!

 

[Munch]

That's what they said about the AEROdrive 8 as well and you see where that has led us too........ advance with caution!

I must say, that the Aerodrive itself is really a good product. I bought it after the Herkules board burned down, it costs quite a lot of cash, but I wanted to kill every I2C-trouble aswell and it works good! But with the right engines.

 

[JLO]

The Herkules lll is coming perhaps in may or june then tests tests and trials that is easily 6 months the Herkules lll are not here, the Plettenberg are, and the selling BS for us to buy has been out for quite some time, ("customers buy this great motors but it will take a year and some unfortunate crashes before the makers of speed controllers come up with sutable ESC....o and by the way the new bords are this much $$$$") I suggested months ago that the dealer talk to the Herkules maker and find a solution in my case because the Herkules maker told me not to use the boards with Orbits 15-20 I crash of my bed when I read his email I was surprise to think they did not exchange specs before releasing this motors.THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS A RECALL .

 

[jrlederer]

Hey guys,
Been a while since I've been around due to some medical issues, but I'm back now. You know how they say that everything happens for a reason? I begin to wonder as had it not been for the recent health complication, I too would most likely have been airborne with the Aerodrive 8 and Pletty's 20-18 motor combination. What I am left uncertain about is if I simply disregard this very expensive package from Pano-Dirk containing the 10 pcs of Pletty's that I ordered after long hesitation but thinking ultimately that the best ought to suffice for such a high-end rig (I guess now that's flawed reasoning), will everything go okay if I simply remount the original 4120/20 Axi motors I had initially purchased for this project, or do I need to worry even about that configuration. The last thing I need right now is to have a mishap after all the problems I've had (generally speaking) up to this point in my life. Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Jonathan

 

[redridinghood]

Both the Orbit 20-18 and the Axi 4120 are too big for the Aerodrive board. I even doubt the Herk V3 can handle those motors.

If you wanna try a YS-X6 or a DJI system I recomend the Castle Phoenix Ice esc's.

 

[DKTek]

Well guys, it's been a while since AEROdron replied back on May 14th,

Thank you for your mail.


We have forwarded your mail to our technicians. You will contact you today.

For further questions we are you at the disposal.


Dear greetings from Switzerland
Bruno

Nothing since then and two request have been sent along with the videos....and a link to this thread.




IS THIS what to expect for "customer service" for your $1700 USD....? Very sad. I even inquired about their Short manual and Express-Warranty extension card when I purchased the AeroDrive and received NO REPLY, there was nothing of the such included with my product.

Product Contents

• 1x 8-fold high performance AEROdrive [SUP]8[/SUP] with heat sinks
• 2x cable with HXT 6mm Gold Connectors already soldered
• Short manual and Express-Warranty extension card

Mostly, I want them to tell me what the light codes mean and how to talk to the AeroDrive. Where are the pins and what is the pinout?

The Wiki pages doesn't cover what I'm seeing since all 8 leds are flashing the same thing. Motors won't initialize yet MK Toolz doesn't report an error....

So exactly am I supposed to do with my $1700 paperweight that apparently has no product support?

 

[Droider]

Aye Up Redridinghood

I recomend the Castle Phoenix Ice esc's.

Are you using these. I was told by my local Castle dealer that they would not be suitable for MR's.

I was looking for the best of the best after realising that the german hobbyist MR FC and ESC controllers could not fully support their products with manuals that are clear and concise.


Dtek.. really sorry to see the results of the crash. The biggest thing events like this do is rodger your confidence in your build and the very carefully selected components used. No help from these so called specialist suppliers of equipment is not good. I have gone away from such products after spending many thousands of sheckles beta testing their kit. It all sounds very professional but the geeks out their producing this stuff HAVE to produce legitimate and accurate instructions and OM manuals for their kit and exept that when they sell beta testing products for lots of money they have to FULLY support the testers!

I just went back to basics and have flown more hours in the last six months that I did in 12 months buggering around with the so called creme dela creme!

Dave

 

[redridinghood]

Well since Castle has been working hard the last few months to create a multirotor specific firmware I find that your Castle dealer should contact base and get debriefed. :nevreness:
4.01 is specifically made for multirotors. A throttle change of 50% can be made in 0.08s.
Only thing wrong about them is their price. But you get over it when you start collecting the logs.

I have my SJ8 down for changing the center plate to the new spec. I will try and do a pictorial when I get a chance of all the features.

Not mine: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=on1DH-Kd9rQ&feature=channel&list=ULhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YnP8D_SG-U

 

[vispaaja]

Has anybody tried these with Plettenberg 15-20's on a Skyjib 8 (or similar)? Are they robust enough?

(Hobbywing FlyFun-60A-OPTO)
http://www.hobbywing.com/product_show.asp?id=198