Please help.... Advice needed on swapping 5.8GHz for 1.3GHz FPV!!

[Mon0bLE]

Hi, so I've been flying a DJI F550 for the last 6 months or so and more recently with a 5.8GHz FPV setup. I've had reasonable success and its been great fun, until...
Last week, I went on a short FPV flight, and I immediately noticed that the video range was significantly reduced. When I landed to check it out, I inspected the transmitter and when trying to unscrew the antenna, the entire fitting came away, solder and all... I've contacted the guys I got it from and established that it was my fault in fitting, and there is nothing that can be done.

Instead of replacing the transmitter, I've been thinking this might be a good time to make a change. Although my experience has been okay, I've only ever been able to fly at quite high altitude for risk of interference, and the penetration of a lower frequency is attractive to me. I'm thinking at the moment of selling my 5.8GHz receiver and clover antennas (anyone interested let me know), and replacing them with 1.3GHz kit.

With regard to the legality of 1.3GHz, I'm not too concerned as I live in the deepest, darkest most rural area of Devon imaginable, miles from any infrastructure with which frequency clashes could be an issue.


My setup at the moment is as follows:

Spektrum DX6i (2.4GHz) (200mw) RC TX
Spektrum AR6210 RC RX
(Estimated range 800-1200m, the furthest I've been is 750m)

1000mw 5.8GHz AV TX (http://quadcopters.co.uk/58ghz-1000mw-av-video-transmitter-tx-499-p.asp)
5.8GHz AV RX (http://quadcopters.co.uk/58ghz-wireless-fpv-av-receiver-485-p.asp)
2x Skew Planar 5.8GHz antenna (http://quadcopters.co.uk/circular-wireless-58ghz-skew-planar-fpv-antenna-490-p.asp)
(Estimated range +1500m, never lost signal with these antennas)
To be replaced with:
800mw (actually more like 600mw) 1.3GHz AV TX (http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=913)
1.3GHz AV RX (http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_34_44&products_id=912)
1.3GHz RHCP Antenna Pair (http://www.readymaderc.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11_45_52_100&products_id=552)

I have a few concerns:
1. Can anyone give me an estimate of the range of the new setup?
2. Should I get a more powerful transmitter to match the old range?
3. Do I actually need other antennas, or would stock whip (RX) and VEE (TX) be sufficient?
4. If I do need antennas, should it be these ones? (I may upgrade to a higher gain, possibly diversity receiver setup later.)
5. Is there anything else about 1.3GHz that I should know about or need? A filter perhaps?

If anyone can answer any of these questions, or if you have any other advice, I'd really appreciate it. I feel like I'm taking a dive with this one....
Thanks in advance!!
M.

 

[Danub]

That video tx/rx from readymade should do nicely. . . I would grab the blu-beam antennas. . . you won't regret it.

1.3g video can cause trouble with the NAZA GPS (you don't mention your FC). . . it can be mitigated, but needs to be dealt with or you can have a GPS flyoff.
It is possible you could have reduced rc range with the 2.4 being interfered with from the video transmitters second harmonic. . . I would do substantial ground range tests before flying

 

[Mon0bLE]

That video tx/rx from readymade should do nicely. . . I would grab the blu-beam antennas. . . you won't regret it.

1.3g video can cause trouble with the NAZA GPS (you don't mention your FC). . . it can be mitigated, but needs to be dealt with or you can have a GPS flyoff.
It is possible you could have reduced rc range with the 2.4 being interfered with from the video transmitters second harmonic. . . I would do substantial ground range tests before flying

Thanks for the reply! Yes I do have a Naza, but not with GPS, will there still be an issue? What kind of problems are there?

 

[SMP]

I've run 1.3 and 5.8. Love the penetration of 1.3 and the video clarity of 5.8. Neither really gave me the range I wanted though for either Video or RC Control. I spent a bunch of money chasing it in antennas and transmitters etc and was never happy. Kloner runs EZUHF for RC Control and 2.4 for Video. I finally took Kloners advice and just received the Disco outfitted with same. I'm still waiting for my batteries to show up so I can't speak to the performance yet but I can tell you that the conversion to 433 EZUhf using the Futaba 8FG was super easy!! Dbl sided tape for the EZUhf TX to the back of the Radio and then a plug straight into the radio trainer port. I'm not sure if EZUhf has a cable for the Spektrum but if so you may wish to consider the same before you jump in with both feet into 1.3.

edit: Oh yes. 1.3 and Naza GPS really do HATE each other. The 1.3 antennas are big so it keeps pushing the GPS higher and higher. On the 550 it needed over 3 inches ABOVE the already big 1.3 clover. Just something to consider as well.

 

[Mon0bLE]

I've run 1.3 and 5.8. Love the penetration of 1.3 and the video clarity of 5.8. Neither really gave me the range I wanted though for either Video or RC Control. I spent a bunch of money chasing it in antennas and transmitters etc and was never happy. Kloner runs EZUHF for RC Control and 2.4 for Video. I finally took Kloners advice and just received the Disco outfitted with same. I'm still waiting for my batteries to show up so I can't speak to the performance yet but I can tell you that the conversion to 433 EZUhf using the Futaba 8FG was super easy!! Dbl sided tape for the EZUhf TX to the back of the Radio and then a plug straight into the radio trainer port. I'm not sure if EZUhf has a cable for the Spektrum but if so you may wish to consider the same before you jump in with both feet into 1.3.

edit: Oh yes. 1.3 and Naza GPS really do HATE each other. The 1.3 antennas are big so it keeps pushing the GPS higher and higher. On the 550 it needed over 3 inches ABOVE the already big 1.3 clover. Just something to consider as well.

Thanks, this was interesting. What kind of range do you think it would be capable of, from your experience? I'd really love to get a different RC system, as I feel it's hindering me. At the moment though I just don't have the money to swap everything. Would 1.3GHz work well with an EzUHF system in the future? I might have to wait a while to invest in EzUHF.
Also, I think there's an issue with UK regulation. I'm not sure how legal, or interference-free 433MHz is here. You can get firmware for the UK to transmit on 459MHz, but apparently the power is limited to 100mw. Would this still be worth it?

EDIT: Also, could you explain the Naza issues? I don't have the GPS unit, is there still going to be problems?

 

[SMP]

What kind of range?? More. How much more?? Dunno. Like all things FPV its a bit of a mystery and range is the worst. My thought process was this. EZUhf and/or Dragonlink are clearly the answer for longer range RC Control. Airplane fliers go MILES. Converting to UHF used to be a pain in the *** tearing the radio apart and such to make the mod. Now using a cable that plugs in the back it's cake. OK so EZuhf wins for RC control. 1.3 you can see its a tree and 5.8 you can see the leaves but both only ran out to .7km on average on my particular bird. That could be my tx, my rx, the antennas, local interference where I fly most and/or the noise floor of the bird itself. Since range never got much better chasing these variables, I changed to convenience and simply went to 5.8 on a set of Fatsharks since I could hop out of the car, throw the goggles on and go flying. THATS NICE! Now that Fatshark has a 2.4ghz module I'm hoping that I'll get the benefits of the EZUHF (range) for control, 2.4 ok penetration/ok clarity w similar range, 2.4 Fatsharks for convenience and added a TBS Disco which should be a lot less noisy than my 550 which SHOULD give me some additional range over the previous 1.3 and 5.8. Basically it's a combination of all of the above.

Heres the thing. Dollar wise it's all about the same. When you switch 1.3/2.4/5.8 systems you're buying new TX, new RX, new Antennas. The only additional cost by going EZuhf is that you need the RC TX and RC RX and Antennas. So yes its a wee bit more but lets say you build the ultimate 1.3 system and you get killer range. Right at that 1km to 1.3km and occasionally 1.7km mark your rc control is going to be at the limit and thats the end of the fun period. Until you solve the RC range issue your FPV range will be limited by same. Anyways, this is all speculation till the batts show up and I get to test.

The NAZA Thing. 1.2 x 2 = 2.4 which is right where your RC Radio lives. Basically harmonics from your FPV system can interfere with your radio control unless you use a notch or low pass filter. No worries, just add another 30 bucks and buy one just to be safe. ADDITIONALLY, the 1.3 cause the Naza gps to take forever or even prevent GPS lock. Just one of those things to add to the 1.3 mix. My question would be, why do you not have the GPS? its one of the few things DJI do very well and frankly add a lot of enjoyment. Get in a little bit o trouble and throw the GPS switch, craft comes to a halt and hangs there. ESPECIALLY handy when you're out pushing FPV range and you lose sight AND/or control. Both of which happen frequently out at the limit. HARD to crash in GPS, even blind

 

[Jackella]

i'm in Uk too.1.3 will kill your speccy range,as advised sort out your control setup first.Speccy wont let you dart low behind bushes etc without failsafe which is what quads do best.
i fly lawmate 1.2 gear and Ezuhf with very little probs,even 3/4 mile behind trees.bushes.ditches etc way out of site with no failsafes.

 

[Mon0bLE]

i'm in Uk too.1.3 will kill your speccy range,as advised sort out your control setup first.Speccy wont let you dart low behind bushes etc without failsafe which is what quads do best.
i fly lawmate 1.2 gear and Ezuhf with very little probs,even 3/4 mile behind trees.bushes.ditches etc way out of site with no failsafes.

Which version EzUHF do you use, the UK 459MHz or just standard 433MHz? Is it true the power is limited?
Is it possible to use 433MHz or is there too much traffic here?
Thanks for your help....

 

[Jackella]

send me a pm for more info if you want

 

[marcf]

I've run 1.3 and 5.8. Love the penetration of 1.3 and the video clarity of 5.8. Neither really gave me the range I wanted though for either Video or RC Control. I spent a bunch of money chasing it in antennas and transmitters etc and was never happy. Kloner runs EZUHF for RC Control and 2.4 for Video. I finally took Kloners advice and just received the Disco outfitted with same. I'm still waiting for my batteries to show up so I can't speak to the performance yet but I can tell you that the conversion to 433 EZUhf using the Futaba 8FG was super easy!! Dbl sided tape for the EZUhf TX to the back of the Radio and then a plug straight into the radio trainer port. I'm not sure if EZUhf has a cable for the Spektrum but if so you may wish to consider the same before you jump in with both feet into 1.3.

edit: Oh yes. 1.3 and Naza GPS really do HATE each other. The 1.3 antennas are big so it keeps pushing the GPS higher and higher. On the 550 it needed over 3 inches ABOVE the already big 1.3 clover. Just something to consider as well.

great info thank you!

 

[SMP]

Have been running the 2.4 setup now for awhile - Once I got the right freqs sorted (Boscam/Airwave/Lawmate) with the right Rx's, all was golden. (note to self, always write which freqs are which on the bloody tx, turns out all tx's look the same in the bottom of the bloody toolbox...) While I really dug the long range of the Lawmate, ended up settling on using Immersion 2400 Duo for the diversity. This allows me to pair Mad Mushrooms for when I need to climb a highrise and a Helical for the distance needed maintain a flatter angle to stay out of the null on the Shrooms. Kinda the best of both worlds, able to fly around, over and up while still pushing distances needed for larger capital improvement projects, wicked steep angles etc.

Ahh... should add. Using this setup dropped me out of using goggles and onto mounting all the FPV gear on the radio.. Basically you gotta point the helical at the heli, tough to do while under a pair of fatsharks...

 

[DennyR]

I am currently running Dragonlink with the tuned version of 2.4 from Immersion. plus a Yaggi. More range than any MR has.
I use a 32 channel monitor with a built in recorder for all my 5,8 stuff. The 2.4 and other stuff can also connect to it through the pole mounted Rx's.

And the Fatsharks are their for the client or if I want to take some nice looking female on a trip where she's never been before......:tennis: