Hi from South Yorkshire, UK

[ROVguy]

Hey Guys and Gals,

I just wanted to say Hi, Im a complete Newbie to Multicopters/Drones, although I have some experience with Remotely Operated Vehicles. I was wondering where exactly to start. I don't own any equipment as yet, but I do have a firm idea as to where I want to go with it... eventually. Im a keen photographer and eventually would like to expand that into Aerial Photography, however, Im wary as to jump straight in and invest ££££'s in equipment without any prior experience, or just to gradually build up. Ultimately I would like to incorporate this side of things as a service in my current business and Im aware that I will have to get the required certification (BNUC etc) to do this.... unfortunately, as I believe their legislation is a bit excessive and the course is expensive!!

Ive tried to find some local clubs, but they all seem to be tailored towards Helicopters or Airplanes, which is not something Im wanting to get into... well maybe not yet. Are there any members on here that are local to me or can give any advice?

Cheers

Rich.

 

[Bowley]

Hi Rich,
step 1, simulator, just spend hours on it, then get a cheap heli (I recommend the Esky honeybee, tough as nails and cheap to repair), you'll get all the skills you need, Its not much like ROV, well not until you start FPV, even then its just different. on the plus side, no tether to worry about.
One piece of advice, once you get confident to fly a reasonable multi, get a versatile one and focus on it (F550 Naza is probably a good suggestion). having multiple machines gets seriously overwhelming if you have a day job and/or family, other hobbies etc.
If you take it step by step with machines you'll end up spending a fortune, I would recommend putting together a cheap "beater" stick with it and master it before you loose your cash on a Cinestar etc.

Steve

 

[ROVguy]

Thanks for the advice Steve, its given me something to think about. I was tempted to just go for as big as I could afford, however, given my previous experience I felt this would have ended in disaster. Btw, I used to be stationed in Kinloss back in the day lol

 

[ROVguy]

What do you mean by a simulator? Are there, domestic software multicopter simulators out there? If so, Ive never seen one mentioned before.

Rich.

 

[Droider]

Aye Up Rich

Welcome to MRF. I started with a little hele but that was a couple of years ago when MR's consisted of th Gaui quad. Stev has suggested a simulator. I hate computer games so I did not bother just spent the wedge on small Blade MCX2's. Now ther is the Blade MQX a BOMB profs little quad for less than a £100. Bargain.

Any how I totally agree with Steve, don't get over complicated to soon, this addiction can end up taking over your life AND wallet.

If you can make it over to Southprt for the weekend of the 15/16th September you will find out more in two days than most find out in a age on the internet. We ae holding the second MRF meet.

The details are here

http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?5335-UK-Multirotor-Forums-Meet-15-16th-September-2012

and here

http://www.multirotorforums.com/showthread.php?1814-UK-European-Spring-Meet-2012


Best

Dave

 

[Bowley]

There is a few, but any RC heli sim will do, some have MR's as part of the model list, Aerosim is geared more to multis, to be honest MR or heli, the skills are more or less the same. clearview is a good cheap option at £26 and downloadable. there are better ones at higher cost but the clearview physics are good, no MR's though as yet,

Kinloss is now the home of 39 Engineer Regt, no longer RAF after the farsical defense review.

The danger in going as big as you can afford is that you may end up too big, ultimately you need to focus on what camera would want to use and start your build from there, cameras are getting lighter and better all the time so you may not need to go as big as you think.
I'm no seasoned expert BTW, but just passing on some of the good advice I got over the past couple of years

 

[ROVguy]

Thanks Steve/Dave, I appreciate the good advice. Arrrgh, the 15/16th September is when I am due to go back to work otherwise I would have loved to have been at the meet, especially as I have family in Formby. Im not particularly one for games myself and very rarely play them, saying that, when you consider the cost of equipment and its replacement, a little time invested on a simulator may be beneficial in the long run, certainly to the pocket.
The reason why I was looking at starting out relatively big is because I was initially thinking of using my DSLR, I have a Canon 7D and obviously the weight of that and the lens fitted is quite large. As previously mentioned, I have a commercial interest in doing this, I dont particularly want to go into too much detail, but it would require being able to take high quality video (but nothing too silly, Im not speaking the likes of Epic or broadcast quality,however HD would be the minimum) and stills, along with being able to record positional data from the GPS. Also, extended flying time would be nice too, more than 30-45mins preferably. I know this is a lot to ask, especially as the taking of high quality video footage with a DSLR would probably necessitate the use of another person and most flying times are around the 15-20 min mark. I am willing to invest in getting what I require... to a certain degree, as the possible rewards are attractive. But if the technology isnt there without huge financial expense then I will have to have a rethink. Regardless of all of that, I still want one!!! lol But thought rather than spending a lot working my way up (its still a large initial outlay after all) that I would start at a reasonable level. I do like my toys and I love photography so thought Id start where I could make use of some of my current equipment.

Steve, I heard about the defense review, I must say Im pretty disgusted with it and it will no doubt bite the government in the arse. I was saddened to hear of Kinloss leaving RAF hands and of the loss of the Mighty Hunter. They will both hold a special place in my heart.

 

[Droider]

R U looking to build your own or buy ready to fly?

Dave

 

[ROVguy]

I dont really mind building my own (so long as frames etc are off the shelf), my only concern is setting up the flying dynamic as I dont have any experience in that area. I think initially it may be wise to by RTF and get used to handling and setting it up and then tweaking/modifying/upgrading it if required. Basically, I have an initial spec as to what I want it to do, I just dont have the experience or knowledge in the area to determine what exactly I will need specifically.

Ive noticed there are no HD video tx/rx systems in use, is that because there just isnt any, or, is it because theres no call for them or are they prohibitively expensive? Also, when it comes to GPS data recording, to what accuracy do you get the positional data? Basically I will be wanting altitude (from sea level in metres) and x y coordinates, ideally both Northings and Eastings and Lat and Long. As you can see, I have no knowledge as to whether this is even available.

Cheers,

Rich

 

[ROVguy]

Is there anyone in the forum local to South Yorkshire or any clubs there? I think it would be good to meet up with someone and get a bit more acquainted with the equipment.

Rich

 

[Droider]

Where do you call South Yorkshire?

I am around next week in Southport if thats any help. I could do one evening. I would still say start small and build up. I have three MR's all working but the F450 is my play / test / practice MR with my bigger ones for work. I do practice with all of them a lot especcially certain moves that I find are required time and time again. Not sure what you want the GPS logging for but yes it is all possible but at extra expense and weight, and complexity. I have learned to keep it as simple as possible and I have yet to go to wy point flying with all the bells and whistles mainley because it has no way of paying for itself at the moment. My new build will be caperble of carrying it if required and I will almost certainly have it on the big um I am planning..

Best advice though I think is start small and the one you start with will become your best buddy for just enjoying flying and testing yourself.

Dave

 

[ROVguy]

I live inbetween near Sheffield mate..... ok its Barnsley, but I just dont want to admit it!!! lol

Having had some time to think about it through the quite night on shift last night and some sleep through the day, Ive decided to do as youve advised and start a bit small. Infact, I was considering going for either the F450 or F550 actually, simply because they appear to be very economical and easy to use. Ive been scouting the pages of Quadcopters and Heliguy for deals. Ideally Im wanting to keep everything under £1000 in the first instance and possibly maybe able to re-use some of the equipment for my future project. I will have to wait and see I guess.

The GPS logging is so the positional data can be mapped and referenced to the video. It will alsp be nice if the data is overlayed on the video as well. I will just have to see how it all balances out regarding cost/weight/functionality/client requirement.

Im afraid, I cannot make next week buddy, all being well I get back from work in Norway on Tuesday and then I go on holiday to Cornwall first thing Wednesday for a week. I should have been going on holiday on the Tuesday, but theres been delays on the vessel Im currently on so Ive had to sacrifice holiday time! Offshore life, pays well, can be interesting, but home life can suffer!

Rich

 

[Droider]

Dont make a decision on just scouting pages. Talk to both before you buy. Personally I would go for a quad first. AND get some lights on it for orientation. If you go to my albums you can see what I mean. It makes flying so much easier. I also have a thread Droiders F450 and some vis on YT under the name Thedroider

Dave

PS U work on rigs or turbines?

 

[ROVguy]

Its not something Im rushing in to, even if I wanted to.... Ive got to get it past the missus first lol. I was thinking of the F450 but thought for an extra £100 I may as well get the F550 and have the extra payload capacity.... Id like to stick a camera or 2 on at some point, to give FPV a try and also HD video/stills, but if I can do this on a F450 then I could go with that. I know what you mean by the LEDs mate, I have seen a few MRC's kicking about and I agree it does make orientation a lot easier. Ive already seen your vids on YT buddy, I will have a look at the thread, given chance.

Ive worked on rigs, vessels and turbines. Im currently doing windfarm work and have been for the last couple of years. Although I did a scientific research trip earlier this year, which was awesome, Im back on windfarms. Ive stepped away from the ROV side of things since starting my own company and Im currently working as a client rep.

Rich

 

[ROVguy]

Right Dave/Gents, how about this for a newbie set up:- DJI Flamewheel F450 Kit, DJI Naza FC+GPS, 3x 5000mah 3S 11.1V Lipo batteries and Charger; all of which from Quadcopters for about £611 and I was thinking the Spektrum Dx8 transmitter + receiver for approx £295 from somewhere else (I couldnt see any transmitters for sale at quadcopters) making a total of £906ish.

FPV gear and landing gear, camera mount and gimbal will just have to wait, assuming you can even get them for the F450, I know you can for the F550.

Question, whats the correlation between the battery voltages and which system you using them on? The F450 kit says its 3S or 4S compatible, from what I can work out the 3S's are 11.1V and the 4S's are 14.8V so which can you use? Is there any advantage to one over the other? What is it about the systems that determine the voltage of the battery pack you to use? Im guessing the motors and ESC's, but like I said Im guessing here. Also, is there a limit as to what mah battery I can use? Again, Im presuming the larger the mah the heavier and larger the physical size the battery pack, which would mean it would depend on the payload capacity of the frame?

Thanks in advance for the advice.

 

[Droider]

Batteries. I like running two. so I use 3cell 2200mah in parallel. Just my precaution if I loose a cell I still have the power to land. My F40 easily carries these with a 3D GoPro set up for 8/10 mins. 10" graupner props. I even build one for Geoff at QC he liked mine so much. As for FPV I got a kit from FPV with goggles. Great kit. If you want a DX8 I have a couple. One is having the Throttle repaired and a general referb so when I get it back it will be up for sale. Geoff can get DX8's to supply with your kit. Other wise RCpitstop.co.uk are as good as any to get it from and James there is also a MR flier.

Dave

 

[ROVguy]

That looks a lovely set up Dave. I like the idea of running 2 batteries, I prefer to have a little redundancy, especially with something that can fall out of the sky! Are you using the 3D set up as realtime 3D or just for stereoscopic images later?

I will keep in mind you possibly having a transmitter coming up for sale. Im not sure when I will be purchasing a system, maybe as quickly as a couple of weeks when I get back from my hold, that being the case I may grab the missus and take a run over to Preston to pay Geoff a visit and see what I leave with lol