DJI S-1000 Warning

[econfly]

it looks to me like those red parts only hold the arms in place until you start the motors and then the arms being held up by lift leaving the red pieces with no load on them at all. if the arm isn't going to the fully up position as the red pieces are being forced into position then maybe they'd break but forcing anything into position isn't good practice so if they break it's not really a design flaw.

what am i missing?

I think that's exactly right. Maybe in extremely rough flight there could be downward pressure on an arm for an instant, but it seems unlikely at best. I would have to think the most likely cause of breaking these arm latches would be a hard landing, where the inertia of the arm is sufficient to snap the plastic.

 

[Shaun Stanton]

I just assembled 6 S1000's for NAB. I personally think that it is one of the best engineered craft that DJI has produced. I would rather have an inexpensive part fail in a crash or "hard landing". That saves the more expensive parts, the arms etc from damage. We have many guys that are flying these with no issues. There was one instance of incorrect production tolerances on a arm and that has been referred to DJI for replacement.

The question in my mind is what happens after several hundred flights when the part wears down a bit and possibly vibrate loose in the air? Obviously the motors lift will hold the arm up but it could cause some nasty vibrations and produce some undesirable flight characteristics. I wold have prefered to see something like a threaded or spring loaded sleeve that would lock the boom arm in place with more rigidity.

 

[Shaun Stanton]

it looks to me like those red parts only hold the arms in place until you start the motors and then the arms being held up by lift leaving the red pieces with no load on them at all. if the arm isn't going to the fully up position as the red pieces are being forced into position then maybe they'd break but forcing anything into position isn't good practice so if they break it's not really a design flaw.

what am i missing?

If the impact is that abrupt than you probably just busted the landing gear and destroyed the gimbal with the camera on it. I see the attempt in the utility behind this, but don't think its save the arm in a real hard impact, i.e a crash IMO.

 

[sk8brd]

its WAY to early for anyone to state the s1000 is issue free or doing fine. how many are in the wild for how long-- two weeks..lol there already has been a report of sloppy motor mounts after 20flights from the rubber dampening washers under the motor being fatigued from engine vibes which is creating slop. let someone put 50-60 flights minimum then do a review. if to held up fine then it held up fine if not it didn't. its way to early to determine wear.

 

[econfly]

its WAY to early for anyone to state the s1000 is issue free or doing fine. how many are in the wild for how long-- two weeks..lol there already has been a report of sloppy motor mounts after 20flights from the rubber dampening washers under the motor being fatigued from engine vibes which is creating slop. let someone put 50-60 flights minimum then do a review. if to held up fine then it held up fine if not it didn't. its way to early to determine wear.

Fair point, though the motor mounts are the same as used on the S800 Evo (as is the approximate load per arm) and there are plenty of them out there with lots of hours on them. On the Evo I can say with some experience that the rubber mounts are a consumable that require replacement when worn. However, there is no wear that I can detect in the carbon fiber mounting material itself.

 

[Shaun Stanton]

. if to held up fine then it held up fine if not it didn't. its way to early to determine wear.

Well when I test out a new car at the dealer I genially can tell if something feels like it was not designed well. I think the same logic can be applied here. The end-user of something like a flying machine that carries expensive cameras should assume the product is fully vetted and you should not be the beta tester of this equipment. Beta testing should have already been accomplished and issues should hopefully have been figured out through rigorous testing.

 

[gmahan3]

Beta testing should have already been accomplished.

I agree with your new car analogy but DJI has a history and the "should have" logic isn't a gunarentee

 

[sk8brd]

if you want a product that is vigorously tested as a a pro solution head over to the freefly camp, you got to pay more but thats been my only recomemdation for years to people that want a vetted pro solution. everyone knows at this point what there getting into flying dji. time and time again products are delivered defective. zen 5d's, early zen 2d's, early firmware for a2 dropping spectrum satts, compass issues early wk.'s etc etc. the world premiere of the ronin with roll off. head to any other site at nab , sony, panasonic, freefly, red, manfratto, kessler crane etc etc and look for a product thats off. you won't find it. there is zero support in the US other then the dji forum members who do help a bunch but thats not enough.. 0 parts available if you got a problem things needs to be sent to china. there a U.S office that does no repairs. whats it there for then.

 

[jjon667]

Yes I know and I was going to buy the Droidworx which was my gut instinct.

 

[sk8brd]

droidworks/skyjibs/cinestar all solid pro frames maybe some not foldable but battle tested and used commercially same with mikrocopter electronics. brainfarm as we speak are filming their red bull flick the art of flight 2. there running at the highest most extreme mountains and conditions in the world day in and day out. they are acting as beta testers before products come into market,there testing the synapse right now as well. if they give a green light and recommend there is a reason for that. they have a crazy amount of resources available to them and if there was something better that would be using it.

 

[leor]

Yes I know and I was going to buy the Droidworx which was my gut instinct.

Do it. Skyjib X4 with MN4014. Its worth every penny.

 

[jimmygixxer]

I'm gutted for the S1000 users who are having problems with it.
I have the S800 with under 20-30 mins flight on it in 10 months, it's back in the shop waiting for new motors and other issue waiting to be fixed, the 20-30 mins flights are test flights that proved the aircraft did not fly in the correct manner.
Good luck with DJI hope you get it sorted out quicker than I have.

Another shabby service from DJI.
Are we all beta testers or mugs I've been wondering

 

[Shaun Stanton]

if you want a product that is vigorously tested as a a pro solution head over to the freefly camp, you got to pay more but thats been my only recomemdation for years to people that want a vetted pro solution. everyone knows at this point what there getting into flying dji. time and time again products are delivered defective. zen 5d's, early zen 2d's, early firmware for a2 dropping spectrum satts, compass issues early wk.'s etc etc. the world premiere of the ronin with roll off. head to any other site at nab , sony, panasonic, freefly, red, manfratto, kessler crane etc etc and look for a product thats off. you won't find it. there is zero support in the US other then the dji forum members who do help a bunch but thats not enough.. 0 parts available if you got a problem things needs to be sent to china. there a U.S office that does no repairs. whats it there for then.

Yeah that's true to a point. However, it wasn't always that way with the freefly stuff. I was a somewhat an early adopter of their equipment. They did take a RC hobbyist approach to some things at first, since that's what they knew at the time. The CS8 is a well designed modular system, I have two myself. The original gimbal using hobby grade servos lacked the robustness that the MOVI has or any of the Brushless Alexmos knockoffs. FF has exponentially matured as a company in the last two years. The nice thing about FF is that Tabb is very receptive to the critiques of all his forum members. I am impressed with the new transmitter the FF is coming out to control camera equipment and the gimbal. It looks like something that's supposed to be on set versus something that I would take on a sunday to the RC park. I agree FF is really knocking it out of the park, cant wait till the synapse finally comes out.

 

[Chadfish]

Generally speaking about quality here, I'm looking for a serious gig for sure, but just as importantly I'm looking for good customer service. We had a fully speced out s1000 package all picked out - dual operator from Aerial Media Pros weeks ago, we just wanted to get an invoice to go over and make out final add-ins etc. Those guys just couldn't get it together to return out emails or calls. Just to get an invoice sent! It's been 3 weeks now. So they lost our confidence. Maybe they build great machines, but we'll never know because they dropped the ball on the first step - letting us give them our money. Then we went to Troy Built, and they treated us very well and were up on customer service. We love that! But now we're sort of waiting on NAB to get over to see if DJI might have a GH4 gimbal coming out soon. Now with this questionable arm lock thing, it's making me rethink the whole thing. On one hand, I like the elegant design of DJI, as well as the folding arms for travel, but I don't like the fact that they aren't in the US, and don't really take good care of customers. I have heard good things about the Cinestar stuff, but my friends that have it seem to spend a lot of time tweaking it. Also I bought Quadrocopter's monitor that attaches to your Tx, and there were design issues I had questions about, and they didn't do anything to get to the bottom of it. Couldn't tell me the manufacturer, and couldn't get it to do what it's supposed to do. I felt like I was bothering them, and no customer should feel that way. If I feel taken care of as a customer, you get my money! Does anyone want 15 grand? Get me a reliable dual operator system that can handle a GH4, and later maybe a RED. Maybe a cnestar 8 with a Movi? I am not against replacing parts and doing repairs, but I want a system that is known for being low maintenance if I'm treating it well. That SkyJib looks cool too! My partner and I have a about 12-15 grand left in out budget for our first medium-heavy lifter, and we don't want to be screwed like the OP, not being able to find parts, or possibly Beta testing a new rig. It's just getting to be flying season, and we need to spend wisely. Being a videographer, and an audio engineer I try to buy right the first time, so I dont have to buy again. What can we get that would lift a Movi and at least a 5D MkIII (though we're starting with a GH4)? What is a reliable, rugged, and professional rig that is sold by people with stellar customer service?

 

[Shaun Stanton]

I want a system that is known for being low maintenance if I'm treating it well. That SkyJib looks cool too! My partner and I have a about 12-15 grand left in out budget for our first medium-heavy lifter, and we don't want to be screwed like the OP, not being able to find parts, or possibly Beta testing a new rig. It's just getting to be flying season, and we need to spend wisely. Being a videographer, and an audio engineer I try to buy right the first time, so I dont have to buy again. What can we get that would lift a Movi and at least a 5D MkIII (though we're starting with a GH4)? What is a reliable, rugged, and professional rig that is sold by people with stellar customer service?

There is a lot of capable frames out there at the moment. My favorite, are the Gryphon Dynamics frames. I think they pulled off what the DJI attempted to do except with more robustness. They are are a little pricey. Your best bet for a medium to heavy lifter to stay in budget that can do as you specified would be a cinestar8 HL with 6S mikrokopter setup. The 500 boom arms accommodate 15 inch props and the 550 for 16 inch props. Your best be is to call QC and ask to speak to Jeff or Flori, they can give you their opinion on what meets your needs. The 500mm booms and 15 inch props are the good bridge between medium to heavy and still carry RED safely. Although it will be modestly gacked out RED. The more weight you want to carry you will need beefier motors and bigger props. Now the trend is to carry even higher then 6S batteries for serious payloads and flight times. In fact it seems that 6S is the new 4S.

Shaun

 

[sk8brd]

agreed with shaun. cinestar hl wise choice-- parts available and support unless you want to go with custom setup for smaller footprint like an x8. there's new efficient motors then a year ago so flight times are getting better. there were a few releases at nab for big custom co axial setups running 28 inch props and u8's enough to lift 2 epics at once lol. if your interested in something that big i know the guy and can hook you up with him. Gene from troy built if thats who you dealt with is a solid guy i wouldn't hesitate to do business with him.. if you want a gimbal option for different cameras and lenses that can deal w/ epic weight m10 is the choice today. i'm waiting for additional testing of a new gimbal thats being released that can carry an epic but can't recommend it as of today. mk flight controllers are a bit different then dji stuff if your not use to it but you would get acclimated like anything else- also the synapse should be out eventually and should be nice. if you have more questions you could pm me i don't know if this thread is best for this..lol i would be willing to recommend certain company's and people in the U.S that i deal with and occasionally provide consulting support for. ohh- i would stay away from zen 5d gimbal there's loss horizon bad on pan when in 2nd op mode. the gh3 zen is good and the gh4 works on it w/out rebalancing and was tested already-- just need micro hdmi adapter card due to gh4 port being different. the word on the street is light bridge most likely will not work on existing zen gimbals..not officially verified but something to think about. let me know if you have more questions.

 

[Shaun Stanton]

The crasiest thing I saw at NAB was the "Double Double Animal Style" Cinestar8 it is two cinestar frames staked together in an X8 Config with 28 Inch Props 12S power using tiger U11's. It is giving me some ideas with my two CS frames :tennis:

The thing supposedly carries 75 KG that's about 165 Pounds!

 

[sk8brd]

yup..:nevreness:

 

[Triple]

Just a point of frivolous contention here: In metallurgy, the word billet, which is pronounced bill-A with a long A for the same reason we don't say "fill-it", billet means a round or square cross section piece of metal. It has been popularized by car accessory magazines and product manufacturers to try to impart some esoteric quality into a metal part as a marketing ploy. Unless one is talking sheet metal, honeycombed or metal matrix composites, billet aluminum and aluminum are the same exact thing. "Sold billet" as in "solid billet" aluminum is quite redundant, as there is no such thing as "billet honeycomb" or billet sheet as that's a linguistic contradiction.

As to the red clips, ABS, which is an abbreviation for acrylonitrile butadiene styrene, it is not a particularly strong or dense plastic. The S1000 red clips seem to be made of a plastic more dense than ABS though. Density, ductility, and ultimate yield strength are just a few of the engineering factors that go into plastic component design. You can have very dense plastic, and if you have a stress riser in the design such as a sharp internal shoulder at a load bearing junction just like the DJI red clips do, you risk stress cracking and ultimate failure. The external retention shoulder on the DJI red clips is a retention shoulder rotating to capture an arm ramp. The component is a low stressed design unless you bounce/land hard. There is constant outwards flexure when clicked into final position. This causes stress, and the internal shoulder is sharp. The internal shoulder radius needs to be changed to a suitably large radius and the aluminum arm ramp that rotates into engagement with it needs a correspondingly matched larger radius for clearance.

Aluminum is not necessarily a better material here, but is a more expensive material to manufacturer with after you have amortized the plastic injection mold die. There are far superior plastics for injection moulding such as polyoxmethylene, also know as acetal resin (delrin) or plastics with fiber reinforcement. The material should be UV resistant and/or come with a mean time replacement factor.

It is most curious for a manufacturer to release a product line to the retail with no spares in the supply chain preplaced.

 

[Chadfish]

Indubitably!