Copter for still photography only

DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Hi. I'm a new at this forum. I've tried to search and read articles, but I can find answer for my questions. If I'm repeating some old topics, then sorry :)

Target: I would like to buy a copter for taking still landscape pictures (no videos!).

Options: Unfortunately, my amateur budget doesn't allow me to buy big enough copter to carry a decent DSLR camera, like Nikon D3s with some prime lense. GoPro and Phantom Vision's camera are not an option either, since their quality and possibilities (manual mode, zooming, filters) are not good enough for my demands. Therefore I decided to select Sony Nex cameras (probably, Nex 7 + 16 mm lense plus radio triggering) due to reasonable compromise between size/weight and image quality.

Questions:
1. Do I really need a gimbal for still photos? My camera will face only forward, no need to tilt it or rotate it. Minor (few degrees) tilts can be fixed later during picture post processing in graphic software. Paying 2.5 k USD for dji gimbal for Nex looks ridiculous. I totally understand, that life is much easier with gimbal. But can I manage without it?
2. Are there any options to control where camera is pointed exactly? I'm thinking about cheap smartphone with skype and webcam. Despite, it is not necessary, camera will be anyway within my sight.
3. Is DJI F550 good enough for this purposes? Any other recommendation? Budget limitation is below 2k USD (1.5k even better!)
4. Do I need a GPS unit?
I'm planning to use the copter in the following way: finding nice looking landscape (like here http://despair.zenfolio.com/p629426364/e2ab92c9a), launching copter, making it floating still at the desired point (over the river), taking picture. Do I really need a GPS to make it float at the same point for a minute?

Thanks a lot for your help.
 

mediaguru

mediaguru

Member
You'll want a flight controller with GPS for a few reasons. First, like you describe you'll need that to hold position. Second, if you lose communication or need to trigger safe mode, a GPS is required for the copter to return to home.
 

eskil23

eskil23

Wikipedia Photographer
1. Not strictly necessary, but recomendable. A multirotor can be very stable, but mostly is wobbles and wiggles a little, especially in wind. A stabilized gimbal will compensate for those movements. You don't have to buy your gimbal from DJI. There are cheeper third party alternatives.

2. With a 3D gimbal you have the option of a two-head operation. One operator to fly the multirotor and another one to fly the camera with one remote each. You can also operate the camera yourself using the turning-knobs on the remote. An even simpler option, which is prefered for FPV, is a 2D gimbal that is locked forward and only compensate for pitch and roll movements.

3. That depends on your AUW (all upp weight) which in turn depends on your payload (gimbal and camera) and your flight-time (how big batteries). I will try to lift a Nikon J3 with a standard F550. The J3 weights 321 gram with a 10 mm f/2.8 lens and I think the NEX-7 is also some +300 gram. If that does not work out, I'll try to beef it up to something like this: http://multirotorforums.com/threads/my-1st-build-f550-custom.22767/

4. Yes, otherwise it will float away with the wind. And you also need it for the failsafe return-to-home function as mediaguru said.
 

Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
Questions:
1. Do I really need a gimbal for still photos? My camera will face only forward, no need to tilt it or rotate it. Minor (few degrees) tilts can be fixed later during picture post processing in graphic software. Paying 2.5 k USD for dji gimbal for Nex looks ridiculous. I totally understand, that life is much easier with gimbal. But can I manage without it?

Denis, I've done mostly photography with my helicopters and you'd be surprised how much less you need in the way of sophistication in order to get good photos. There are a lot of the older "servo-driven" gimbals available that are actually better for photography because they don't care as much if the camera is perfectly balanced on them. This enables you to land and switch lenses without necessarily having to adjust or balance the mount, you can just fire the heli back up and fly. You will need a gimbal though or your photos will have slanted horizons, structures will be out of alignment, etc.

2. Are there any options to control where camera is pointed exactly? I'm thinking about cheap smartphone with skype and webcam. Despite, it is not necessary, camera will be anyway within my sight.

We use analog wireless video systems that have many hundreds of meters of range and which can be adapted to most cameras. A camera with composite/analog video/audio out such as the Canon T5i makes this easy to do. Cameras with digital HDMI output only can still be used but you'll need an HDMI-to-analog converter. having a live feed from the camera will enable to you line up your shots exactly as you'd like them to be and it will save you a lot of time knowing what you are shooting.

3. Is DJI F550 good enough for this purposes? Any other recommendation? Budget limitation is below 2k USD (1.5k even better!)

Probably not for the camera you are talking about using and the additional equipment that will be required to make it all work. I've heard pof people using Tarot frames for their builds but I'd bet you can find something perfectly suited for your purposes in our classifieds section if $2000 is your budget.

4. Do I need a GPS unit? Do I really need a GPS to make it float at the same point for a minute?

No and yes. No but it will make your life a lot easier if you can park the helicopter in one place using GPS to have the helicopter maintain its position. While it's sitting there in GPS "position hold" you can use your video goggles to line up the shot and then review what you've shot afterwards all while the helicopter maintains its position using the onboard GPS. I tend to be something of a perfectionist so if I want to get a very specific shot then I don't want the helicopter drifting out of position every time I glance down into my goggles to view the camera feed.
 

DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Bartman, Eskil23 and mediaguru! Thanks a lot for your responses, they helped me a lot.

Ok, now I can see that GPS is a very usefull thing. Sony NEX 7 has HDMI, so I can use this video for aligning camera.
Tried to search ebay, found some gimbals of reasonable price (400 USD)

I would be very grateful if somebody could point out exact models (or link to ebay or other shops) of a suitable copter and gimbal. I've already browsed through a lot of webshops, but all those descriptions are just making me confusing, since I don't have any experience in this field
 



Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
@DenisDespair do you plan to fly by yourself or will you have a second person that can operate the camera?

the reason I ask is that if it will be you working alone then you'll want a 2-axis camera mount as it will stay aligned with the heli and you'll point the camera by yawing the helicopter and tilting the camera.

if you expect to have a second operator most of the time then you can pick up a 3-axis mount and it will enable the camera operator to point the camera regardless of the heading of the heli.
 


Bartman

Bartman

Welcome to MultiRotorForums.com!!
how much does it matter if you can fold it up and travel with it?

if it doesn't matter then I'd look for an older hexacopter with an AV-130 camera mount. we're talking about an older heli but it will be cheap and still do exactly what you need. the av-130 is great for photography (I have two of them) and should fit that camera very well.
 

DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Bartman said:
how much does it matter if you can fold it up and travel with it?

if it doesn't matter then I'd look for an older hexacopter with an AV-130 camera mount. we're talking about an older heli but it will be cheap and still do exactly what you need. the av-130 is great for photography (I have two of them) and should fit that camera very well.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, this matters. It should be possible to fold or disassemble it to some extent, so that I could take it with me to different trips (or flights to another country)
 


eskil23

eskil23

Wikipedia Photographer
DenisDespair said:
Looks good, thanks.
How is it with mounting gimbals to a copter? Are there just bolts+nuts or should I consider any compatibility issues (except of weight)?
Click to expand...
Mounting the gimbal can be a bit tricky unless the gimbal is made specifically for the aircraft you have. But most gimbals are made to be mounted on the underside of a flat surface, so with a bit of effort it can be worked out. If the underside of your multirotor is a Power Distribution Board, it is not wise to drill holes in it. Better then to mount another plate under it.

DenisDespair said:
From where is gimbal powered? From copter's battery?
Click to expand...
Mosty yes, via a BEC (battery eleminator circuit) to regulate the voltage. Some people who fly large multirotors use a separate battery, but for smaller aircraft it is not worth the extra weight.
 


DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Well.. I have been browsing through different online shops and I'm still quite confused. I dropped emails to a couple of them (hobbyking.com and rclegends.co.uk) and asked "how can I spend approx 2.5 k USD at your shop?", but they didn't answer. Probably there business is going too well without me.

I would greatly appreciate if somebody could list a complete set-up (copter, controls, gimbal, gps, transmitter, whatever else?) to use with sony nex6 camera. Preferably european shop (otherwise I need to pay extra 24% tax), but not necessary. I'm seriously tired of reading all that descriptions and trying to understand what is compatible with what. Thanks!
 

A

alvinl

Member
Hey Denis, have you found anything that could work for you?
Have you taken a look at SteadiDrone's FLARE? its listed as $2499 ready to fly - right where your budget is.
http://www.steadidrone.com/drones/steadidrone-flare

Its foldable so you can travel with it, and can take a bit more than a gopro. For the Sony Nex5/7 you might need to go for the MAVRIK instead of the Flare. It does cost $4999 ready to fly.

If you're not constrained by the type of camera, you might want to take a look at the DJI Inspire 1. You'll be locked into their camera there, but I've seen quite good results from others who have it so far.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Alvinl, thanks for suggestion, but 5k USD is a bit too much. I'm thinking about assembling my own copter, it seems to be cheaper.
No way I would ever use those compact cameras, I've seen DNG file from DJI Phantom 2 vision. They are not worth 1.5 k USD price
 

S

schwett

Member
I got into multicopters for basically the same use you describe, shooting landscapes and cityscapes from angles that can't be achieved from the ground. i always fly line of sight and rarely use GPS, but it can be useful when you get in a bind or out of control, or to hold a position against the wind. never do video except to test things.

I got a close-out s800 about a year ago, added the evo stabilizers, and 3d printed a simple custom mount to attach a nikon d810 to the legs. I set the camera to interval shooting, set group AF to the lower third of the frame, and basically forget about the camera while flying. it works very well and 36mp gives me lots of flexibility for rotating and cropping if I didn't quite nail the shot. flight time with two 4200mah batteries, the d81o, a 20mm f/1.8 lens, and a small fpv setup that I added for fun is about 12 minutes.

the nex weighs enough less that maybe you could away with a similar setup on a flamewheel?
 

C

Claust

Member
I had the Tarot 680 frame, its good value.

Couple of things I didn't like was the cramped space for electronics, the soldering points close to the folding arms (stressed wires when folding and unfolding), so did not fold it, and the red plastic parts (clamps, gear locks) tend to break easily.

Maybe one of the newer Tarot frames would do it?

I used a Arris ZhaoYun gimbal for a Sony A6000, but be prepared for some tuning if using it for video, for photo its quite good. Used 6S batteries and DJI S600 motors/ESC's.

Moved to a DJI S900 recently (Actually, gone from Phantom, F550, Tarot 680 to DJI S900 in less than 2 years)
 

DenisDespair

DenisDespair

Member
Sorry for the late answer :)

Schwett. I used to have 20/1.8 sigma lens (before I destroyed it by falling from bicycle on icy road), it is a huge.. Probably its weight is more, then small nikon body. I agree with you approach, but now I've changed my mind and I'm looking for 3D gimbal :)

Claust. I've bought already T810 frame, it should be better
 

You must log in or register to reply here.
Top