Commercial aerial photography in UK
- Thread starter pcoombes
- Start date
Dave
You are doing this the right way. If you have an Ops. manual that has been approved then you can sell that on to someone else. I did this many times with banner towing manuals once they had been approved. The CAA are like solicitors in that they want to give you the run around, it's how they make money. If you present them with one that has been approved they don't have anywhere to go unless there have been changes to the rules. They don't like GA as the real money comes from the airlines. The airlines don't like GA because the CAA say that they are supporting it. The CAA say that GA has to support it's self. I expect that UAV comes under the same heading as General Aviation. The weight of most aircraft is exceeded by the weight of the paperwork before it's life span is over. Sounds like some enterprising outfit has taken the UAV approval scheme to the CAA and wants to act for them but under their direction. That wont last.
Before long you will need a form before you can carry out an assignment and there will be lots of obstacles that you will want to overcome so a fee will be payable for this special request and then they write back and tell what you already knew and say you cant do it.
Any civil servant will always so no to any request because it make life easy.
My AOC used to cost around 20 K per year. that was ten years ago. Today only a few flying clubs can legally carry out AP If you want to shoot in controlled airspace you have to have an AOC. So most do it on the quiet.
You are doing this the right way. If you have an Ops. manual that has been approved then you can sell that on to someone else. I did this many times with banner towing manuals once they had been approved. The CAA are like solicitors in that they want to give you the run around, it's how they make money. If you present them with one that has been approved they don't have anywhere to go unless there have been changes to the rules. They don't like GA as the real money comes from the airlines. The airlines don't like GA because the CAA say that they are supporting it. The CAA say that GA has to support it's self. I expect that UAV comes under the same heading as General Aviation. The weight of most aircraft is exceeded by the weight of the paperwork before it's life span is over. Sounds like some enterprising outfit has taken the UAV approval scheme to the CAA and wants to act for them but under their direction. That wont last.
Before long you will need a form before you can carry out an assignment and there will be lots of obstacles that you will want to overcome so a fee will be payable for this special request and then they write back and tell what you already knew and say you cant do it.
Any civil servant will always so no to any request because it make life easy.
My AOC used to cost around 20 K per year. that was ten years ago. Today only a few flying clubs can legally carry out AP If you want to shoot in controlled airspace you have to have an AOC. So most do it on the quiet.
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Macsgrafs
Active Member
As I said Dave, I'm not against doing any test, but I don't know how they can justify £1500...for after all something that is a big boys toy!
The BMFA certificates cost NOTHING....just proves to me it's all about money & keeping us poor people from advancing in life. I can see many problems ahead as many will simply say I cant afford it & fly anyway, but some of those many will be rank amateurs & accidents will happen.
As I stated previous, I do NOT charge for aerial photos/videos...my camera operator does!
Ross
The BMFA certificates cost NOTHING....just proves to me it's all about money & keeping us poor people from advancing in life. I can see many problems ahead as many will simply say I cant afford it & fly anyway, but some of those many will be rank amateurs & accidents will happen.
As I stated previous, I do NOT charge for aerial photos/videos...my camera operator does!
Ross
Macsgrafs
Active Member
There is no law that says you have to pay tax!!!! same as there is no law that says you have to pay council tax!!!
Too many have been duped by the powers that be...it all boils back down to money, one rules for the poor & no rules for the rich!
Ross
Blacksails
Member
Freeman power!
Macsgrafs
Active Member
quadcopters
Quadcopters.co.uk Drone Specialists
Are you saying you can get away with not paying council tax without the Big Bailiffs giving you a knock at the door ? or doing a session at her majesty s pleasure .
Blacksails
Member
Have a look at the freeman movement. It's all about common law (not causing harm or loss, basically what a good conscience tells you what not to do) vs commercial/admiralty law and what actually applies to a human being. Person in legal terms (blacks law book) is a legal fiction that legislation and commercial law can act upon. A person is not a human being in law, and legislation/commercial/admiralty law can only act upon the person (legal fiction) and not the human being.....unless consented to.
Unfortunately there seems to be a lot of idiots calling themselves "freemen" and using this to get out of parking fines etc without knowing the law inside and out, which ultimately lands them in doo doo. To use this stuff effectively you NEED to be well versed and educated in Law and be prepared to fight your case in a court of law, where one bad move WILL get you in trouble. It's interesting stuff though.
Check out your vehicle papers, are you listed as the owner or the keeper? When the vehicle is registered you hand over ownership and become the registered keeper, which is why your car can be taken and crushed if given reason. Your not the owner....which also raises worrying questions about birth registration (the word birth taken from admiralty law, as in birthing a ship)
Ross, feel free to correct this. I just have a passing knowledge of it.
.....sorry, completely off topic.
Unfortunately there seems to be a lot of idiots calling themselves "freemen" and using this to get out of parking fines etc without knowing the law inside and out, which ultimately lands them in doo doo. To use this stuff effectively you NEED to be well versed and educated in Law and be prepared to fight your case in a court of law, where one bad move WILL get you in trouble. It's interesting stuff though.
Check out your vehicle papers, are you listed as the owner or the keeper? When the vehicle is registered you hand over ownership and become the registered keeper, which is why your car can be taken and crushed if given reason. Your not the owner....which also raises worrying questions about birth registration (the word birth taken from admiralty law, as in birthing a ship)
Ross, feel free to correct this. I just have a passing knowledge of it.
.....sorry, completely off topic.
Droider
Drone Enthusiast
Blacksails... it is interesting stuff.. BUT I have tried standing up for myself only to be beaten by those who knew better in law and had more money than me to throw at it.
We are getting off topic in a way but I do respect everyone opinion and interest in this subject of Commercial Aerial Photography in the UK. As it stands in the eyes of thems that say what we can and cannot do, (bsically coz they got bigger brothers than we do and lots of money behind them) we have to bow to the rules laid down as thems that know better and can chuck us in jail no matter how free we may claim to be!
Dave
We are getting off topic in a way but I do respect everyone opinion and interest in this subject of Commercial Aerial Photography in the UK. As it stands in the eyes of thems that say what we can and cannot do, (bsically coz they got bigger brothers than we do and lots of money behind them) we have to bow to the rules laid down as thems that know better and can chuck us in jail no matter how free we may claim to be!
Dave
plingboot
Member
it's a case of least course of resistance for me. my northern breeding doesn't like paying any more than absolutely necessary, but if the right bits of paper mean i can do some AP work with little or no hassle, then irrespective of the system's faults, it's got to be worthwhile.
i also think that a large group of folk who've been through the process stand a better and more credible chance of changing it at a later date.
sad thing is that it's the nobs who buy a big bird and go flying over people and property without any due care or attention are not reading these kind of threads, taking heed and considering the consequencies of their actions.
i'm almost ocd about MR build, mainenance and flight situ awareness, but a duff esc, motor or interference can strike any of us so id rather be in a position to say and prove id gone by the book.
i also think that a large group of folk who've been through the process stand a better and more credible chance of changing it at a later date.
sad thing is that it's the nobs who buy a big bird and go flying over people and property without any due care or attention are not reading these kind of threads, taking heed and considering the consequencies of their actions.
i'm almost ocd about MR build, mainenance and flight situ awareness, but a duff esc, motor or interference can strike any of us so id rather be in a position to say and prove id gone by the book.
Blacksails
Member
As I said, you need to know the law inside and out to use any of it. I do not use it as I do not, and have not studied law and therefore don't dare try it. I just have an interest.
I agree that the bnuc-s is a pain and very expensive, but it does help to prevent atleast some of the newbies from putting heavy equipment in the air on not-so-airworthy flying blenders.......
I agree that the bnuc-s is a pain and very expensive, but it does help to prevent atleast some of the newbies from putting heavy equipment in the air on not-so-airworthy flying blenders.......
Ross, far be it from me to let the facts get in the way of your strongly held beliefs, but the EuroUSC examination is not £1,500. The ground/theory examination is £350 and the flight test is £350 too, for a total of £700. It might still be too much, but it's really quite a lot less than £1,500. Reference:
http://www.eurousc.com/documents/BNUC-S_ftc_web.pdf
The theory course is £700 but you are not obliged to take it and can just do the theory exam and practical test.
Personally I do think the £350 per test fee is excessive, particularly for the written paper; my pilot's licence tests cost less than that and there were 7 of them. The trouble is there is no competition, presumably mostly because there is little demand. There is nothing to stop anyone setting up a flight school and getting it approved, as has been discussed elsewhere. But the costs of doing so would have to be recovered and maybe you'd not be able to turn a profit whilst charging substantially less than £350.
http://www.eurousc.com/documents/BNUC-S_ftc_web.pdf
The theory course is £700 but you are not obliged to take it and can just do the theory exam and practical test.
Personally I do think the £350 per test fee is excessive, particularly for the written paper; my pilot's licence tests cost less than that and there were 7 of them. The trouble is there is no competition, presumably mostly because there is little demand. There is nothing to stop anyone setting up a flight school and getting it approved, as has been discussed elsewhere. But the costs of doing so would have to be recovered and maybe you'd not be able to turn a profit whilst charging substantially less than £350.
Macsgrafs
Active Member
Blacksails you're 100% correct with the difference between a person & a human & how admiralty law (statutes/acts) only apply to a peron & NOT a human.
Here's a video of a man called Guy Taylor, trying to do a magistrate for breaking laws against him...I know its off topic, but if nothing else just watch part 2 the first 18 seconds...I will explain what he tells the judge.
"There is NO law that can EVER be passed to legitamise a magistrates court"...thats taken from thier OWN law book (Hailsburys):
Swisser thanks for the info, I dont mind paying £350 I might even stretch to £700...but remember I am unemployed at present & my mrs only works part time in a garden centre
I read a file hosted by the CAA that only asks for experience...no mention of BNUC!
Ross
Here's a video of a man called Guy Taylor, trying to do a magistrate for breaking laws against him...I know its off topic, but if nothing else just watch part 2 the first 18 seconds...I will explain what he tells the judge.
"There is NO law that can EVER be passed to legitamise a magistrates court"...thats taken from thier OWN law book (Hailsburys):
Swisser thanks for the info, I dont mind paying £350 I might even stretch to £700...but remember I am unemployed at present & my mrs only works part time in a garden centre
I read a file hosted by the CAA that only asks for experience...no mention of BNUC!
Ross
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Macsgrafs
Active Member
Geoff, its easier for YOU to show me the law that says I have to!!!!! The council cant show anyone that law, all they can show people is the statute that says they have to collect council tax!
Baliffs are the biggest joke ever, I had one on the run last year, especially when I started charging them for my time...his firm ended up owing me money & they backed off.
Remember my friend, if you have to correct a firms mistakes then you have a right to charge...that includes any corporation...police, courts, baliffs, council, BT, water board etc etc.
Ross