camera mount vibration - looking for solutions

[jhardway]

I have a camera mount that I am having exessive vibration which is showing up in video. I am wondering if there is some quick solutions out there. I am thinking of making a type of vibration mount. I have seen some doing it with silicon tubing and somehow mounting them to a bolt.

I am wondering if I could do it with silicon and a rubber gasket.

Just trying to figure it out, if any one knows ways of doing this I would like to hear from you, also if you do not of good small anti vibration parts out there I will take that also.

cheers Jack

 

[Sebas600]

Need more info and preferably photos.
Balancee motors and props? If thatvis done there shouldn't be any heavy vibes...
For small vibes get gyrogel pads from allign.

 

[gadgetkeith]

hi jack

i had a quick look over on fpvlab forum

for the mounts that i saw the other day and got a couple of pics for you

View attachment 2919this is what he made from silicone tubing and allen head bolts

View attachment 2920and here is another pic showing how he uses them between cam gimbel and main body

he explained how he made them by using a drop of ca glue on the heads of the bolts before pushing them into the tubing then finishing of with cable ties
what he does not mention but probably did is
put a small cut off bit of silicone between the bolt heads for total isolation to save bolt heads knocking and causing unwanted vibes
hes putting a fpv hexa togeather
hopfuly someone could post a link for you
its on fpvlab multirotor section
like i said before some good stuff out there just gotta keep looking
keith

 

[ovdt]

I have been experimenting about vibration isolation for a quite long time now. The right usage of silicon dampers are like these:

http://www.vibrationmounts.com/RFQ/VM01035.htm

So, using that isolation bolts as you described helps but will not work as intended.

Also check out this: http://forums.openpilot.org/topic/6888-flexacopter-the-making-of/page__st__80


And this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=113TB7YKMUw

 

[MombasaFlash]

I have been messing around with anti-vibration solutions for about four years now, starting with cameras mounted on a Raptor 50. I went through countless designs mostly based on suspending the camera frame. The 'camera frame', as I call it, was a rigidly made aluminium frame with a 2-axis gimbal at the front, electronics and servos in the middle and batteries + downlink at the back acting as a counterbalance to the camera weight.

The methods of suspension varied from hanging the long frame members in foam tube - very effective but delicate - to thin gauge bungee to home-made circular gel isolators on an aluminium tube. Occasionally the tension of the bungee was just right to allow the frame to hang without touching any of the vibrating helicopter, but most of the time they were too tight or too loose allowing the whole frame to wallow.

I was following the basic idea employed by manufacturers of underslung camera mounts that attached to the helicopter by hanging on the foam covered skids.

The point of all this is that most 'hanging' isolation methods - such as the silicon tube and bolts method - are not ideal because they allow the camera mount to swing around and possibly bounce. More reliable is gel under compression. This however takes a bit of ingenuity because the weight of the camera mount etc has to be applied ABOVE the isolators which is not always easy with the tiny spaces available on models.

The so-called isolators which are no more than stand-offs made with rubber are not very effective. Perhaps better than nothing but the rubber is just too hard and, once again, everything is hanging.

For the time being I am using a very basic mount on this relatively new Droidworx, the Highsight SLR2. Video results so far have been fairly promising and vibration has NOT been particularly evident. However, a few days ago it was quite windy and on that occasion I did not notice some hints of what could have been vibration. So I have modified the simple plastic standoffs that bolted directly to the underside of the lower chassis plate and installed some simple gel compression dampers using the gel pads that are sold by regular MR suppliers.

Three flights today with three different cameras (5D, NEX-5N, Panasonic HDC-SD9 camcorder) in very gusty conditions have shown them to be very effective.

It is an experiment and I will probably re-work it slightly because getting those little plastic nuts on is a *****.

Uncompressed ...

and compressed ....

 

[Sebas600]

That is a great idea. did you also widen the holes?

 

[MombasaFlash]

On a single rotor you have to try and avoid ALL contact with the airframe to eliminate transmission of vibrations. However, unlike single rotor heli's the vibrations on these MR's are not so severe and mostly high frequency so it seems to be sufficient that the bolts can pass back and forth, even if they still come into contact with the sides of the holes. Widening the holes would seem a sensible thing to do but introduces the risk of the bolts slopping around.

 

[jes1111]

European source for small vibration isolators: www.gelmec.co.uk

 

[ovdt]

Very inspiring design MombasaFlash! Thanks for the pics.

 

[MombasaFlash]

I have a camera mount that I am having exessive vibration which is showing up in video....

I do not know what airframe you are using but I am actually a little surprised that you are experiencing a vibration problem - assuming that all the tedious stuff has been done i.e. prop balancing. I do not have a great deal of experience with these MR's but one thing has always been consistent and that is relatively stable, clean video right off the bat.

The clip below is from the 'garden session' a day or two ago and was a quick test with the silicone pad mod detailed above. However, I still not convinced that the mod is actually completely necessary because previous vids have also been vibration-free.

 

[BorisS]

Another inspiration maybe Jack.

I am using one of the virbation mounts from ovdts links on my WKM Hexa.

View attachment 1793View attachment 1794

Be careful though vibration mounts should also not be to soft or you will get a flex or wobbles on your cam. Thats why i fixated the mounts back to the frame giving me the possibility to tighten or loosen the silicon effect to my needs.

 

[MombasaFlash]

I am absolutely in agreement Boris that soft gel left to its own devices can allow the whole thing to wobble. The gimbal on the pro heli has gel isolators acting on lateral as well as vertical axes on the main supports with further dampers supporting the camera itself. Unfortunately the MRC's do not have quite as much space to play with - but then they don't generate as many vibes either!

 

[BorisS]

sorry for taking this a little of topic. Mombasa du you have a link or info page concerning top quality prof. heli cam mounts. I am not informed what is out there and i would be interested what those are all about etc.

Thanks

Boris

 

[MombasaFlash]

... do you have a link or info page concerning top quality prof. heli cam mounts...

Not really. There are certainly loads of options out there but how they all match up is still a big question.

The mount you see in the picture is from Copterworks, USA. It IS widely used in various applications, not just helicopters, but has its own set of peculiarities that have to be accommodated - much like all the others. It is of course far too big and heavy for multi-rotor use but quite apart from that is the problem presented by its configuration of Pan - Tilt - Roll. The important thing here is that the Roll axis is inside the Tilt axis, plus the fact that all servos are 360° continuous rotation. Pretty much ALL other options like PhotoHigher, PhotoShipOne etc. have Tilt inside Roll and built-in FC camera stabilisation or Piclocs work best with this latter configuration and also require standard, unmodified servos for the most part to limit the mount's travel in each axis. Yes, the Roll axis often has a 360° servo to allow sufficient travel with the gearing. Anyway, back to the plot, with the CW mount, by the time the Tilt is at 90° the Roll axis has effectively become a Pan axis, as far as the stabilisation electronics are concerned and they consequently get confused and the Roll can either start to wander around or just go berserk.

I have had to counter this by ensuring that the stabilisation sensors for the Roll axis are kept vertical at all times. It is a bit of a farmyard hack but it does at least work. If the Tilt axis were inside the Roll, the roll axis would not be affected in any way by whatever angle the Tilt is at.

One of the 'strengths' of the Copterworks mount is that 360° is available in all three axes. In practice I cannot see how this could ever be useful because sooner or later unwanted bits come into view and I have limited the end-points on both Tilt and Roll for just this reason. Pan should also be limited but I am still awaiting upgrades to the electronics. As a stop gap the Pan axis has to be manually turned on or off.

There, that helped to take us way off track didn't it? :shame:

 

[Bartman]

keep in mind that a lot of videos where a camera is rigidly mounted to a frame with velcro have little to no vibration. i've adopted the theory that is you can't control a movement like roll or tilt then you have to constrain it and keep it from moving. it seems to me that the more rigid i make things the better my video gets. most of my work has been to make my roll and pitch mechanisms as smooth as possible and my props as balanced as possible. my camera mount is very nearly rigidly mounted to my frame and given virtually no room to move or shake when I fly. I should have the latest version flying in about two weeks so I'll know better then if it's everything I'm hoping it will be.

 

[MombasaFlash]

It rather depends on the sizes and weights involved. Velcro can be a good vibration absorber for fairly lightweight items, particularly receivers and electronics. Perhaps GoPro's, certainly not any pro cameras. But as Bart implied, the best and most obvious anti-vibration philosophy is to reduce or eliminate the original source. With helicopters this is anything that rotates at high speed i.e. motors and rotors, whether single or multi-bladed. When there is hardly any vibration produced there is hardly any mess to clean up.

You can't make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

 

[holco]

We use our own designed wire dampers system build in the Flexacopter and are very happy with the result.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=113TB7YKMUw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIRecvf733U&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M25FzcZ-_dI&feature=related

 

[MombasaFlash]

Boris, I forgot to ask. How effective have you found the CineStar silicon ring dampers to be? At $75 each one would hope they work.

 

[Bartman]

a good exercide for anyone trying to improve their equipment would be to try to remove all elements of "vibration isolation: and see what they are left with. using quik-ties, electrical tape, nuts-and-bolts, etc it's possible to remove all freedoms of movement other than what the FC can provide in tilt and roll compensation. from there, removing the constraints one by one will allow you to see where vibrations in your video are originating.
just a thought

 

[jhardway]

Ok ao after many good input I believe I may have found the cause for my vibration. Now I would like to listen again for possible solution. Before I start I do not have balanced props yet. I do have a balancer come in the next day. With that said I also have found some play in one of my AVroto motor. This is being caused by ever so slight play in the (i guest to term it) anchor cotter pin on the bottom of the motor where it holds down the shaft. I do not feel the play until I give the shaft a pull directly upwards. So when the motors hits a certian RPM then the vibration harmonic resignates through out the frame.

It seem this is something that can happen, I do not know if its normal. I guess that is one of my questions, I also believe once I have my prop balanced this may go away.

Also to fix the problem with the play is it a matter of getting another cotter pin to snug up the play??

Looking to listen, thanks in advance.

JackView attachment 1841