Motor, Flight Control and/or Z15 Weirdness

[teecee]

I have seen this a couple of times now where all my motors appear to "stutter" and my Hex rocks violently back and forth for a few seconds while my Z15 5D gimbal is on (never without). The first time I noticed this was when I was yawing one way (with Hex) and then went the other way immediatly. I figured that the weight of camera and gimbal made the flight controller hickup due to the quick change in rotational direction so I made a point of NOT doing that any more. Today it happened again when we were shooting some practice video and coming back for a landing with camera pointing down. Gimbal was yawing and I don't think the Hex was and it looks like there was no change in rotational direction. Here is a link to a video ( https://vimeo.com/87036230 ). You hear it but don't see at 16-18 seconds in. THe Hex is rocking back and forth while the noise happens then all is fine. The gimbal cancels out the motion on the video so you can only really hear the problem. Any ideas??

-Carboncore H6 950
-A2 Flight Controller
-Z15-5d Gimbal
-60 amp Maytec ESCs
-TMotor 4014-9's

 

[atpfilms]

Are you running your gimbal control off of the same radio transmitter as the hex? If so, there may be a loose wire from the gimbal to the reciever that could be affecting the way the radio interacts with the reciever.

 

[teecee]

Are you running your gimbal control off of the same radio transmitter as the hex? If so, there may be a loose wire from the gimbal to the reciever that could be affecting the way the radio interacts with the reciever.

Nope. Totally different radio. The only thing that the gimbal and hex share is S-bus cable connection from flight controller and power...

 

[atpfilms]

Nope. Totally different radio. The only thing that the gimbal and hex share is S-bus cable connection from flight controller and power...

I just watched the video. Strange. I would say radio interference possibly, but if its happening repeatedly, then it seems like maybe a flight controller issue. I'm not really qualified to get into this any deeper, just thought I'd help troubleshoot a bit. I would assume you checked all of your props and motors and made sure they're secure? Incidentally, I've got the carboncore 950 as well. Wondering what setup you've got - batterys?, dji retracts? total weight? flight time?

 

[teecee]

I just watched the video. Strange. I would say radio interference possibly, but if its happening repeatedly, then it seems like maybe a flight controller issue. I'm not really qualified to get into this any deeper, just thought I'd help troubleshoot a bit. I would assume you checked all of your props and motors and made sure they're secure? Incidentally, I've got the carboncore 950 as well. Wondering what setup you've got - batterys?, dji retracts? total weight? flight time?

Thanks for the input. Everything is good and secure.
I updated my sig to be a little more specific about my rig. Still very much a work in progress. Apart from this scary little glitch my biggest problem right now is flight time. It is terrible. With my AUW of 17.5lbs I am getting 2.5 minutes before first level LED starts flashing. I have flown it right to red LED where it comes down (1' off the ground) and that is usually around 5-6 minutes with full weight. It is not enough time. I am thinking of trying 10,000+ mah batteries. What do you use for batteries? Your AUW? Flight times? How do you like the CC Hex?
I wish there were other people close by doing this who I could get together with. Forums are a great help though!

 

[teecee]

Here is a video I did this afternoon showing what I am talking about here.

https://vimeo.com/87130325

The issue is clearly visible at 00:24 and again at 00:39. This issue does not seem to take place without the camera and gimbal on.

 

[Tahoe Ed]

Teecee,

That is very bizarre. I am not sure if it is an esc problem or a controller issue. My guess based on your comment that this does not occur with the gimbal and camera on, it is a load issue for the esc's. I may be wrong but since I have no experience with the Maytechs or the motors you are using I am shooting in the dark here.

 

[teecee]

Sorry for any confusion - it only happens WITH the gimbal and camera on...

 

[Tahoe Ed]

Understood.

 

[teecee]

So today I was doing a test with new batteries to gauge max flight time and I was just bobbing up and down checking thrust and it did the horrible weirdness again. No yawing at all this time, just quick up/down 10' or so with camera and gimbal on. This is a real worry and makes me not so confident in my mean flying machine. Someone told me it could be compass declination. Anyone had experience with that and the A2? My declination is -10° 5' where I am located. Could it be that my compass is fighting with my GPS and confusing my poor little flight controller? I wonder... I really hope to resolve this issue. I don't like it when machines don't work the way I want them to.

 

[Quinton]

So today I was doing a test with new batteries to gauge max flight time and I was just bobbing up and down checking thrust and it did the horrible weirdness again. No yawing at all this time, just quick up/down 10' or so with camera and gimbal on. This is a real worry and makes me not so confident in my mean flying machine. Someone told me it could be compass declination. Anyone had experience with that and the A2? My declination is -10° 5' where I am located. Could it be that my compass is fighting with my GPS and confusing my poor little flight controller? I wonder... I really hope to resolve this issue. I don't like it when machines don't work the way I want them to.

Sorry that is scary, something def not right there.
Prob is it is very glitchy,.
Where is your IMU located, and what is it held on with?
I would not be happy with that going on, time to take a step back and try and eliminate anything that could be causing it.
Theres usually a reason for everything...finding it though is a different story.

 

[teecee]

Let's just say the problem worked itself out today... Went out for one last sunset shot. I was about 750' away and 50' up and it started making the stuttery noise, tipped over and went straight down into snowy field. Bye, bye hex, Canon 5D, zen Gimbal and the rest of it. The A2, which ironically, was probably to blame may be salvaged. Maybe I'll take a break from flying for a little bit...
View attachment 16416View attachment 16417View attachment 16418View attachment 16419View attachment 16420View attachment 16421

 

[Quinton]

Let's just say the problem worked itself out today... Went out for one last sunset shot. I was about 750' away and 50' up and it started making the stuttery noise, tipped over and went straight down into snowy field. Bye, bye hex, Canon 5D, zen Gimbal and the rest of it. The A2, which ironically, was probably to blame may be salvaged. Maybe I'll take a break from flying for a little bit...
QUOTE]

OMG..that is not good at all, really sorry to see that, I am sure you are devastated.
Hopefully you can at least salvage your 5D somehow.

 

[teecee]

Let's just say the problem worked itself out today... Went out for one last sunset shot. I was about 750' away and 50' up and it started making the stuttery noise, tipped over and went straight down into snowy field. Bye, bye hex, Canon 5D, zen Gimbal and the rest of it. The A2, which ironically, was probably to blame may be salvaged. Maybe I'll take a break from flying for a little bit...
QUOTE]

OMG..that is not good at all, really sorry to see that, I am sure you are devastated.
Hopefully you can at least salvage your 5D somehow.

I think the brand new 5D may be dead. Motors, ESC's and A2 OK. Gimbal may be fixable too with new ribbon cables and???
Here is my take away: IF THERE IS A PROBLEM - FIX IT OR GROUND THE MULTIROTOR UNTIL IT CAN BE WORKED OUT. Wtf was I doing flying the camera and gimbal package when I knew there was an issue??? User error! Lesson learned.
What's next? S1000...???

 

[Tahoe Ed]

Let's just say the problem worked itself out today... Went out for one last sunset shot. I was about 750' away and 50' up and it started making the stuttery noise, tipped over and went straight down into snowy field. Bye, bye hex, Canon 5D, zen Gimbal and the rest of it. The A2, which ironically, was probably to blame may be salvaged. Maybe I'll take a break from flying for a little bit...
View attachment 20407View attachment 20408View attachment 20409View attachment 20410View attachment 20411View attachment 20412

TeeCee,

I am sorry for your loss but you knew you had an issue with the gimbal and camera mounted and you continued to fly without a resolution to your problem. I did that once and destroyed a S800 and Zen15 with a Nex5N. If I am having issues I am grounded until I get a resolution. There are way too many dollars in the air to risk them. I really am sorry and do feel your pain.

 

[Tahoe Ed]

I will go back to my original observation that this is a motor/esc issue since it only occurs when the craft is under load with your gimbal and camera. Do the Maytec's have any recording functions where you can see what is going on with the esc?

 

[MombasaFlash]

Does this look at all like your issue?

This is a brand new S800 EVO with an A2 FC. I did not attempt to fly it with these 'motor spasms'. The same booms were then moved to a standard S800 and it flew normally. So the A2 seems to be the likely (only?) suspect.

I will replace the A2 with a new one before I bother with the tedious fault finding process.

 

[SoCal Blur]

That is really tragic. The more I see of this kind of devistation, the more I wonder about the possibility of some type of device that would automatically deploy a parachute, like they have in model rocketry, if a sudden decent is detected. Depending on how high you are it may not prevent damage but there may be less of it. Just a thought and, I'm sure, not a new one.

 

[teecee]

Does this look at all like your issue?

Mine was a bit different than that and was only apparent with camera and gimbal while flying. I posted a video early on in this thread.

 

[sk8brd]

So sorry Teecee! i was really hoping and pulling for your rig to get sorted flightime wise w/ new batts and now this. Sound like the esc gave up or some type of battery issue like the copter was having a hard time keeping up with amp draw maybe. What kind of power distribution are you using? If this only happened when it was loaded up then i would believe it was a power issue cause of the demand of more energy compared to when not loaded. does the A2 have a blackbox? i thought it did. if one esc gave out i would think with latest software it would still stay in the air just like Quinton's as long as you enough thrust left w/other motors-just speculating here- about that stutter. no doubt were all guilty of wanting to fly and being over zealous at one time or another but it's always the right thing to ground it if any thing arises little or big-i know you know that but for other members. let me do some research about the maytach esc's and those motors.

i know it doesn't matter now but did the diff batteries make a difference of flight time at least?