Hoverfly Pro or Wookong FC for new X8 ?

[Bartman]

Dolby: You mentioned having both but then you mention APM 2.5 GPS. Do you use the APM with the WK or HF or is this on a 3rd setup? I'm just a little confused on this one.

As to cameras, my initial flights will be with GH2, GH3. with the GH2 or 3 being the main filming camera. I doubt I'll fly a gopro other then on some initial flight testing. I will do some photography with my 5D mkII and if my bird is rock solid, I may fly a Blackmagic Cinema Camera on occasion.

jfro,

my comment about gimbal control was referring to the 2 axis control that is part of the Hoverfly PRO. It's very smooth, better than the MK's resident controls. If the Hoverfly Gimbal is even better then I'm going to have to try it because the PRO's camera controls are really good!

 

[jfro]

Bart, thanks, I assumed that after reading some of the other comments.

With the HF Pro, I understand that in a pinch, I can hover for a bit and try to get my act together, and then if need be, it can auto descend.

In other words, it appears that if in trouble, one can at least get it to hoover withing in a few meters of it's current altitude. While it won't fly home or to a destination, it willl at least self descend if needed. Do I understand this correct and if so, does it work reliably.

 

[kloner]

I hit altitude hold twice, once it fell like a rock, next time it did this

the only thing reliable about hfp is manual and self level modes...... the rest is like it's not there, hence you better know how to fly or i'd go with the wk. Judging by the questions asked, i'd recomend wk

 

[PaNt]

I hit altitude hold twice, once it fell like a rock, next time it did this

the only thing reliable about hfp is manual and self level modes...... the rest is like it's not there, hence you better know how to fly or i'd go with the wk. Judging by the questions asked, i'd recomend wk

what version do you have? 4.6?

 

[kloner]

yes, rev 3 on a freshly calibrated board

 

[dolby]

Dolby: You mentioned having both but then you mention APM 2.5 GPS. Do you use the APM with the WK or HF or is this on a 3rd setup? I'm just a little confused on this one.

As to cameras, my initial flights will be with GH2, GH3. with the GH2 or 3 being the main filming camera. I doubt I'll fly a gopro other then on some initial flight testing. I will do some photography with my 5D mkII and if my bird is rock solid, I may fly a Blackmagic Cinema Camera on occasion.

My APM 2.5 is just on my Droidworx cx4 frame at the moment. It takes a ton of time tuning pids to get it to fly decent. It's a big time waster right now.

The reason I'm even playing with the APM is I want to make a virtual bumper with some sonic sensors when doing industrial inspections so I dont have to worry about getting to close to the object. I'd love in the future to play with some type of 3d camera for object recognition as well. Also the free waypoint system is kind of fun to tinker with too. The APM will suck any free time you have away in just tuning it though and you may never get it as smooth as a HFP or WKM.

An octo is nice for a 5d but certainly not required although if you ever want to lift a FS1000 or Epic its required. A heavy lift hexa or y6 will lift a 5d no problem, with the nice low kv motors and large props and 6s lipos they can do a very good job.

 

[jfro]

Kloner
"the only thing reliable about hfp is manual and self level modes...... the rest is like it's not there, hence you better know how to fly or i'd go with the wk. Judging by the questions asked, i'd recomend wk"

Very much a consideration. More money = easier flying...... I am older and more conservative, so I might be worrying too much about the worse case scenarios.

B Rowland. What do you think. I believe you are flying mostly in manual mode. What was your experience level when you started flying the HFP? Again, your video's are more in line with the type of stuff I'll be doing so I'm not sure how worried I should be regarding flying in manual mode all the time.

Kloner, would you be saying the same thing if you were flying closer in and flying slower than what I've seen in many of your video's. You seem to be more into distance and speed than I will be.

The pro's and con's of this are not clear cut other than I see Ben's work which I like and see him doing it on the HFP which fits my price point.

There is no doubt I'd be happy with either, but in the short run, $450 v s $1170 is a big difference on a 2k build.

I am factoring in minor crashes and having to fix parts. It's just the unknown of totaling 2k-3k worth of parts vs a few $100 in repairs on a crash. Camera's I have plenty, so that's not an issue. It's the cost of repair for the multicopter and gimble that are of concern.

Going to have to decide pretty soon. Keep opinions coming. I value all your experiences.

 

[Bartman]

the consequence of flying the Hoverfly PRO without GPS will be that you will likely have to keep it closer to you so as to not lose orientation and risk losing or crashing it. An FPV feed from the heli will certainly help but a lot of people count on the "Return Home" function to save them if they become very disoriented. The HF PRO won't have that without the GPS and even with the GPS the jury is still out on its usefulness. Some people will tell you that the HF GPS works well and is a valuable tool, others will say it needs a lot of work and isn't up to the performance of other systems. I tend to agree with the latter but am hopeful things will improve.

A lot of the smoothness you see in videos posted here and elsewhere comes from the pilot and the immense amount of time it takes for a pilot and helicopter to develop a relationship they can both live with. It's work. Photos are relatively easy to pull off, video is work and will require you to be persistent and resourceful to make it what you want. The flight control is only one piece of the puzzle, you'll survive and do fine with either when it really comes down to it although I suspect the native camera controls on the HF PRO are better than the WKM.

 

[PaNt]

yes, rev 3 on a freshly calibrated board

thats why...! I have told them several times that there is a major problem on this version..!!!go to 4.3 and you will be very very happy..!

I cannot understand why they dont Mark this version as Beta... ITS FULL OF PROBLEMS>.!

 

[tombrown1]

the consequence of flying the Hoverfly PRO without GPS will be that you will likely have to keep it closer to you so as to not lose orientation and risk losing or crashing it. An FPV feed from the heli will certainly help but a lot of people count on the "Return Home" function to save them if they become very disoriented. The HF PRO won't have that without the GPS and even with the GPS the jury is still out on its usefulness. Some people will tell you that the HF GPS works well and is a valuable tool, others will say it needs a lot of work and isn't up to the performance of other systems. I tend to agree with the latter but am hopeful things will improve.

A lot of the smoothness you see in videos posted here and elsewhere comes from the pilot and the immense amount of time it takes for a pilot and helicopter to develop a relationship they can both live with. It's work. Photos are relatively easy to pull off, video is work and will require you to be persistent and resourceful to make it what you want. The flight control is only one piece of the puzzle, you'll survive and do fine with either when it really comes down to it although I suspect the native camera controls on the HF PRO are better than the WKM.

I think there is a bit of a misconception about orientation. Knowing your orientation is not necessary to be able to fly your rig back to you. If you're a quarter mile away and can still see your machine, but don't know which way it's pointed, then you will notice that moving the controller one way will make it go left or right. This instantly tells you your orientation. Now if you fly out of line of sight then good luck. Home lock/RTH is a luxury to make things easier, but not necessary by any means.


Tom

 

[Bartman]

I think there is a bit of a misconception about orientation. Knowing your orientation is not necessary to be able to fly your rig back to you. If you're a quarter mile away and can still see your machine, but don't know which way it's pointed, then you will notice that moving the controller one way will make it go left or right. This instantly tells you your orientation. Now if you fly out of line of sight then good luck. Home lock/RTH is a luxury to make things easier, but not necessary by any means.


Tom

Tom,

It's not that easy for everyone especially when panic sets in. A good friend lost a 500 size heli after becoming disoriented and you'd expect that to be easier to see because of the more distinct front/back/etc.

Especially in attitude (aka manual) mode where there's no level assistance from the flight controller it can be a challenge to get one back home when the pilot's lost situational awareness. More of a challenge for some than others but a challenge nonetheless, IMHO.

 

[tombrown1]

Now full on manual mode is different - very difficult to bring back if you lose orientation. I don't know HFP, but if it has an equivalent to DJI attitude mode (not GPS, but not manual either), then there shouldn't be any problem flying with momentary loss of orientation for a moderate pilot. And if it is much smoother than WKM as some seem to say, then I may think about switching over.


TB

 

[jfro]

I'm going to sleep on this, but here's my probable decision and logic for my FC choice.

I think I will stick with my plan and go with HoverFly Pro w/out GPS.

This is going to be a process.

Build and fly manually keeping the distances short in the beginning.
Work with shorter flights to achieve the quality of video I'm looking for.

After getting the camera stable and getting comfortable with flying my rig, I'll add FPV capabilities.

I called Hoverfly today and as I hoped, working on the GPS features is a very high priority for them right now. I'm going to put my faith in an American manufacturer and give them a chance to solidify and add features to their GPS system over the next 6-9 months.

When I have a need to fly farther or higher AND I'm ready, I'll make a decision as to add the HF GPS or switch over to the WooKong. That's a decision that doesn't have to be made right now. That gives HF some time to make some improvements. Rock solid basics are all that is needed right now.

It's a $450 decision that can be changed later on by selling it used and purchasing the Wookong. What I'd lose on selling the HFP used is about the cost of 1 good battery.

So, plan is to sleep on this tonight and then probably tomorrow order the HFP unless something new and substantial pops up.

Thanks all for your expert opinions!

 

[Simon Templar]

Simon, when you get your HFP make sure you approach it as though its a totally new thing. Sometimes new users coming from other systems expect the HFP software and setup to work the same way, its different. There will be things you like and things you prefer the dji way. Also make sure you read the manual and go on the zendesk help website for information about updated firmware and setting up.

Stacky, thanks for the advice.

As I already have it installed, I'm keeping the WKM and F550 combo. The HF boards are for a new build I'm planning. I'm getting them second-hand so I am sure I'm going to be wandering around a bit before I get it all sorted.




....sT

 

[jfro]

With 8 Avroto 2814's, any suggestion for good choice on 4s lipo C rating. Kind of looking at 30c to 45C, but not really sure what the pro's and cons are for the different ratings. Looking at the 5000 to 6300Mah range.

Found some Gens Ace 5000MAh 4S 40c in a hard case which is 25-50g heavier than most other comparable batteries in softer shells. The soft shells are out and these are priced right.

I don't understand why there is such a price difference between brands, esp when I read on the forums how many of these are peoples favorites for the hexa's and octos.

Example turnigy 5000 4s 30c $62
Gens Ace 5300 4s 30c $76

gens ace 5000 4s 40c hard case 77 depending
HYPERION G3 VX 5400mAh 4S 14.8v 35C/65C LiPoly Pack $128
HYPERION Hyperion G3 5000mAh 4S 14.8v 35C/65C Lipoly Battery Pack $120
More confusion.

 

[kloner]

Why do you relate flying far and needing GPS?

 

[jfro]

Do I relate flying far and needing GPS. Not really. I probably equate flying far distances more with FPV.

GPS features for me in order of priority would probably be
1. fly back to starting point if lose radio control or just fly back cause I've messed up.
2. Circle around a given point
3. Fly to way points.

My starting wants would be #1 followed by the other 2 points.

 

[DucktileMedia]

For what's its worth the Hoverfly GPS does work really well for RTH. It is very smooth and as long as you have plenty of room it will get a hard to see Heli back in your site without having to worry about going into a fail safe mode.

 

[kloner]

Does hfp GPS have waypoints?

 

[kloner]

A used hfp barely fetches $250