Newb looking for someone to help (paid consulting) on my first RC FPV quadcopter

[ummagawd]

Hello All,

Been reading up on this stuff for the past couple of weeks and have decided that I want to get into this. I think I understand how daunting this can be and to be quite honest, time is something that I do not have a lot of. I get the fact that you simply learn a heck of a lot more building things yourself (and I think I'm still open to that), but I've decided that I'd rather enlist the help of a seasoned pro (compensated if you accept PayPal) to help me through this journey.

So what am I looking for in this consultant/mentor, or however you'd like to describe yourself...

I need you to:
1 - Consult with me, ask me questions about what I'm looking for that I might not have even thought about. You can call me or we can chat via email or any other means.
2 - After understanding me and my intended purposes, I'd like for you to put together some options (a checklist of things to buy, including alternatives, along with the cheapest place to buy them). If after talking to me, you think it's best I go the RTF route... by all means. OR... let me know what you would charge to build the thing for me. Please note that I'm not simply looking for a list of what you bought, you must take into account my budget, by intended use, the possibility of me selling this stuff later (if it turns out to be something I'm just not into after all), learning curve, etc...

What I'm looking to do with this hobby:
1 - FPV flying! I live about a mile away from the beach and am fortunate enough to have a sundeck at my apartment. I'd LOVE to be able to put some goggles on, sit back, and go see what's going on at Huntington Beach.
2 - Videography is a secondary hobby of mine. So if I ever run into a gig where there's an opportunity for aerial footage... I'd love to be able to use this.
3 - Although I understand that FPV and videography folks favor smooth and stable flight characteristics, I'd still like for it to be fun, fast and nimble.
4 - At the end of the day, this is still a hobby for me... so I'm not looking for anything pro-grade (unless you tell me it's worth it).

Requirements/Constraints:
1 - I'm working with a $1000-2000 budget
2 - I used to be into RC offroad trucks when I was in my teens, so I'm familiar with R/C in general... however I know nothing about copters or anything that flies.
3 - It's my understanding that certain things require tuning via a computer? I'd really like to stay away from that unless you think I can learn it fairly easy (also I only have a mac)
4 - Ideally, I'd like to use a go pro camera so that I can at least use it for other applications.
5 - I obviously don't have alot of time to really get into this, so pre-configured items with short learning curves are preferred.

Shoot me an email at ummagawd@gmail.com stating the following:
1 - how much you want to get compensated
2 - what kind of experience you have to offer, along with any applicable consulting experience (i'm a consultant myself)
3 - where are you located?
4 - How soon you could start (after all, I'm just waiting for my tax return )
5 - about how much time you think you'd need with me (based on what I've shared thus far).

Thanks for taking the time to read this!
Tommy

 

[tahoelight]

What I'm looking to do with this hobby:
1 - FPV flying! I live about a mile away from the beach and am fortunate enough to have a sundeck at my apartment. I'd LOVE to be able to put some goggles on, sit back, and go see what's going on at Huntington Beach.

Uh, sorry to burst your bubble but this is Not a great goal to have. This sort of flying, even if it is just hobby, is what is going to shut us all down. I am sure others will agree. We will all chime in and help if you honestly tell us you will go to a flying field away from people or even just your back yard.

I obviously don't have alot of time to really get into this, so pre-configured items with short learning curves are preferred.

You don't want to get into this hobby. If you don't have the time, it won't happen. It is life consuming! Really, ....l

 

[Tomstoy2]

I have to agree. I've seen a lot of people come into this with the same attitude,,, can't recall any of them staying with it. It's the same thing as reading a good book vs. having somebody compose the footnotes to brief you about it. If you are serious about exploring this hobby, I would suggest getting a good arf kit, such as the DJI kits, and put it together. We here at this forum, or any other, are more than happy to help you out with questions and suggestions. It's all part of the hobby for us. I would also suggest you reconsider the safety attitude these things demand. Even the small multi's can ruin someone's day.

 

[dazzab]

If you don't have time to put in it, and a real love/fascination for things that fly, then this just isn't for you. If you want to have some fun just playing around then try something that's ready to fly out of the box like a little Parrot or maybe a DJI phantom. In spite of these looking like toys and being fun, do keep in mind that you can really hurt someone with one of these so you really can't use them to see what's going on where people are. They also have a very short range as you FPV is not something anyone but a very experienced flyer wants to get in to. It's not as easy as it looks. A lot of time and training goes in to it. Along the way will be a lot of crashes that will go well above your budget.

 

[ummagawd]

I appreciate the heads up about "that sort of flying". I apparently have yet to learn about that aspect. I honestly was so caught up in being able to "fly" that I didn't even think that sort of flying would be looked down upon. I understand it from a safety perspective (I'm sure one of these things can cause serious harm to a person), but it was not something I had planned on doing recklessly. As I mentioned, videography is one of my other hobbies and I thought it would be cool to shoot the beach area from an aerial perspective. But in thinking about it more, something goes wrong in a highly populated area could definitely end in bad news.

As far as time going into this hobby, I just know how I am with these things. My real concern is that it WILL be yet ANOTHER hobby that consumes my life (I'm a music producer, I'm a DJ on the weekends, I shoot videography, I like to build vintage cafe bikes, I just recently geeked out to the whole vaping thing... it just never ends with me). And so what I was really trying to do was cut some of that learning curve out and make friends who can help me avoid newb mistakes and even possibly get into some gear that will provide some value over the life of this hobby for me (i'm a firm believer of "buy once, cry once" if that makes sense to anyone).

Anyways... I just spent some more time on youtube learning how to put these things together (I've been eyeing a TBS discovery) and the intimidation I originally had that has mostly gone away. I'd just like to understand the things that I need in practice/reality vs. what I think I need in theory. For instance, I thought I really needed an OSD... but I think that if I ran a setup that RTH when it sensed low battery or went out of range... then I probably don't need to be concerned with an OSD.

But enough with that advanced stuff... let's start with a nice cheap quad for me to practice on.... in knowing that i'd like to get into a TBS discovery some day.... would the Walker Ladybird be a decent beginner/trainer quad to learn on?

thanks for all the info and help fellas

 

[tahoelight]

My Kid has a ladybird and I love to fly it. Stress free training. It is super fun to fly. I think this would be a great start. You will probably want to bump up to a TBS size fairly quick, but at the same time you can use the ladybird as a training tool forever. Order it, learn to fly and keep reading through the many pages of trial and error we all write about. You'll be hooked.

 

[PeteDee]

The Ladybirds are pretty good, I have a couple of rebuilt hybrids but would probably recommend you get a good radio and an mQX to start with.

Pete

 

[ChrisViperM]

I like to build vintage cafe bikes,

....that certainly will secure you my support. :tennis:


But building (and riding) vintage bikes is very similar to the Multirotor world. You first have to fully understand how these bikes work before you can start to build one....and there is no short-cuts. What looks so easy at first sight is full of pit-falls, frustration, head-shaking and smashing things against the wall. As Tomstory2 said, we are all here to help you, since you look like to be a nice guy. What could help you to see it a bit more realistic is, if you find somebody from the forum living close to you, which would be willing to spend half a day with you and some of his gear just to show you a bit how things work......you will be surprised how small the Copter becomes in the air only beeing a few meters away from you....and how difficult it is to find out where front and back of that little dot in the air is......


Chris

 

[Tomstoy2]

As Chris says, they do get VERY small in a hurry! What nobody has said, the panic mode that sets in! Your knees turn to jello, your heart rate sky rockets, your breath comes in short gasps and you get a quart of adrenalin shot into you system instantly. All this panic leads to bad decisions and down she goes. When things go bad, they go bad in a damn hurry!!! The sign of a GOOD pilot is one that can still keep his head in the game and work thru all of that mess. There isn't one of us that does not experience this. Next up is the mechanical failures that happen in flight. These really suck! In flight, you can do nothing about these, just stand there in total shock and watch you beloved bird plummet to it's death. It possibly the worst feeling of all. All you can do is what we call the walk of shame. You walk out there to collect the mess, head hanging down, deep in thought as to what the hell went wrong this time, collect up the many pieces and walk back. The only way to prevent this walk is to learn about every aspect of your aircraft, what works and what doesn't. It's time consuming and costly. Your desire is to keep the damn thing under cost control but you soon learn that it's really a money pit. After you do finally learn what works and you have 'paid your dues' you soon learn that you have spent many thousands of dollars in a 500 sized multi!!! If you are married, you start hiding things from the wife, ( the dreaded controller of the budget ), but soon discover that she's on to you and your stupid little toy! After all, your seriously cut into her shoe budget. It's a winding twisted and bumpy road we all live to just spend a few blissful moments in the air. The payoff is small, expensive and fleeting. But when things do finally go right, it's the best damn feeling in the world!!! Better than anything any drug can give you!

 

[kloner]

it's weird how the whole screen name then you read the story.... crazy man. if you hadn't responded like you did i'd call bs to the whole deal....

discos are a blast but not much for a beginner. get on a small rig, learn to fly it and at this point set your goal to build and fly a disco after youve torn something smaller and cheaper to bits. being able to fly fpv reliably and consistantly is years in the making. if forward flight fpv is your thing, consider a plane like a skywalker to cut your teeth on. I'd plan using a field less populated and un forgiving like the ocean to train on. we use a canyon a mile or two inland. always consider the risk of fire when you send a model anywhere.

 

[ummagawd]

thanks guys.... it's all starting to sink in and phase in with me so I really appreciate the repsonses and info. I am married... so I better be smart about this haha.

Okay... so here's my new newb plan.

My heart is set with a quad, because I do want to be able to fly well enough to shoot aerial video with a gopro for personal purposes at some point. And in getting over the fact that I'm just not going to pick up FPV flying that as quick as I want to... I think I want to spend a little more on my beginner/trainer setup as I slowly build a TBS disco

I was thinking of getting the ladybird V2 + the TX 5808 FPV add-on + fat shark goggles... this way the fat shark goggles can be re-used for my future TBS disco build. That way I get some "in-sight" flying experience in, then when I get comfy with that... add the camera and start practicing FPV indoors.

Another route I was thinking (but I need your guys' help if this will work) was to buy the ladybird V2 WITH FPV already built-in, but NO transmitter:

http://www.rc-fever.com/index.php?r...currency=USD&gclid=CIaFhZKo2rYCFQE6QgodYhoAoQ

and then use it with my own radio that I'd eventually use in the TBS disco build. However, I get the feeling that I can ONLY use a Walkera Devo series radio.... is that true? If I was going to use say a futaba T8J or whatever it is that's recommended for a long range TBS disco build... could I use that to fly the little ladybird FPV? I guess I need to start asking you guys for recommendations (please let me know if this is not the appropriate forum for this).

 

[photobobga]

My flight path as viewed for professional photography and video applications was:

- Purchased the Blade mQX without the bundled transmitter; purchased the Spektrum DX6i transmitter. I have over 50 flights on this
- Purchased the RealFlight simulator and flew the GAUI quad for 40+ flights
- Six months later...
- Purchased and built the DJI F550. 30 + flights on the stock system, have upgraded the motors and added a gimbaled landing gear setup, and FPV
- Still not comfortable flying this beyond 100 yards, it turns into a small pizza box in the sky.

BTW, I own (and ride) a 1972 Norton Commando and 1959 Norton Dominator. I understand what frustration is. I also have a great amount of respect for others safety.

Having some experience with older R/C gear is not an advantage. Everything has changed, new digital multi channel everything Tx & Rx with manuals near an inch thick, new lithium polymer batteries that will explode if not charged correctly, and new brushless motors that if not matched correctly to all the supporting hardware will burn up.

If you have an extra $800.00+ dollars and still want to give this a go try the DJI Phantom. The ladybird is fine for indoor flights... get it above a small tree with a small wind blowing and... goodbye ladybird

Let us know what you end-up with...

Bob

 

[ummagawd]

Man... always wanted a Norton, but I don't have the patience to source those parts anymore

My current (last bike) is a 75 cb400f and i love the damn thing.

Anyways... so after listening to everyone and spending another good 8 hours of reading and reviewing different things... I've decided to NOT even think about what "big" quad I want, and instead spend my focus on micro-quads. TO be specific, I just purchased a ladybird V1 along with a Devo 10 Tx. After seeing how much online support there is for this little guy (or girl I suppose... it is called a a LADYbird after all right?), and reading up and watching videos of just how far some folks have gone in modifying the little thing... I figured it would be a good, cheap-way to see just how much I'll get into this hobby without outgrowing it too quickly. In fact, one of the videos (http://youtu.be/TXis3r-344k) had his ladybird confidently flying about 300m away with a custom FPV and everything.

So the plan is to confident flying the LB in it's stock form indoors, then move those skills outdoors. Once I'm happy with that, then i'll start with some weight saving mods (to help with the weight i'll be adding back on going FPV). Then i'll start researching for an FPV setup (although I'm already starting to eye this guy... http://www.fpvhobby.com/143-sub-nano-combo-set.html except I'm concerned about radio interference being that it's 2.4). Finally, once I'm happy with that and have developed good FPV flying skills, I'll start looking into how to increase range (and believe me... i'll push the envelope on this).

My goal now is to actually be satisfied with a "long range" FPV micro-quad, to the point that I can justify to myself that I do NOT need a bigger quad (i know good luck to myself with that one). I think i've limited myself going with a devo10 (in terms of being able to use it for a bigger quad build), but I'll worry about that later. In fact I believe there's a firmware hack that would allow me to use it with other brand Rx's.

Anyways... thanks for everyone's help. Any additional feedback would be appreciated (I am looking for a FPV setup that's micro friendly and does 5.8 off the bat so I can justify fatshark goggles )

 

[smoothvirus]

I just got started flying FPV on a quad with Fatsharks on 5.8.
Your plan makes sense to me so far. After many months of research I went with 2.4ghz for control (already had it for my planes) and 5.8ghz for video. I would recommend you stick with 5.8 for now. I would also recommend against the DX6i - I own one and it's fine for bind and fly models and small electric parkflyers but for what you want to do you will outgrow it very quickly. I outgrew mine in only a year although I still have it. Also the gimbals on the DX6i feel very cheap compared to other transmitters.
If you go with 2.4 for control I would recommend the DX8 instead. You will have people tell you never to use Spektrum for FPV but you can safely ignore them. Just be aware of the limitations of that system - you will likely get reliable control out to 500 meters or so. Beyond that it will depend on if you are facing towards the model and how high your antenna is but you may be able to reach 1km or roughly half a mile. I would not venture farther than that on Spektrum. Before you attempt any long distance flight you must be certain that you have a very robust failsafe system that includes return to home/return to launch. And you must test it beforehand so you know it works if you get an unexpected lockout.
Purchase a radio with enough channels so you can assign the failsafe function to a switch. Some people will test their failsafe by turning off their radio. DO NOT ATTEMPT THIS.
There are many options in the 2.4 band, and nearly all of them are good. I have heard of very nice results with the Turnigy 9x radios with a frsky module. Others can help you with that if you go that route.
As far as safety considerations go you should always fly as if your quad is going to throw a prop and drop straight down out of the sky at any moment. This means you should never fly directly over people or crowds. Avoid flying over structures or vehicles.
If you really want to push your range then you'll want to start looking at long range systems like the ezuhf, dragonlink, rangelink, etc. I am only at the research stage on these so others can help you out there. The long range units are a unit you attach to the back of your transmitter. Be aware that by going to LRS you are increasing the level of complexity of your system by quite a bit.
Personally, I don't see the need to fly long range with multirotors. A half a mile is a long way away on a quad.
My setup is very simple, I have a Naza based quadcopter, Spektrum radio, 5.8 video with bluebeam antennas, and Fatsharks with a mini DVR for recording my flights. That's all that I am using. It's a very straightforward setup and it works.

 

[ummagawd]

Thanks for your feedback! After some more research, I've concluded that 5.8 is the way Togo for FPV. So I'm glad it's in line with your suggestions.

Noted on the additional features that should be a "must have" for long range. RTH is a definite for me.

Quick thing, I went with the devo 10 (which I believe is walkera's devention series). I know this doesn't exactly fall in the "high end" arena, but it's a 10 channel and have read on a handful of people using it for their bigger builds with deviation firmware hack. Of course I read the group that puts it down saying they wouldn't trust it, but they also couldn't back it up with why not nor have any documented instances of failure. So I'm curious as to what your thoughts are considering you went with spektrum despite the naysayers

 

[smoothvirus]

Quick thing, I went with the devo 10 (which I believe is walkera's devention series). I know this doesn't exactly fall in the "high end" arena, but it's a 10 channel and have read on a handful of people using it for their bigger builds with deviation firmware hack. Of course I read the group that puts it down saying they wouldn't trust it, but they also couldn't back it up with why not nor have any documented instances of failure. So I'm curious as to what your thoughts are considering you went with spektrum despite the naysayers

Every system has its naysayers but you have to take what they say with a grain of salt. From my experience the Spektrum naysayers either had a Spektrum radio several years ago when it was still using DSM2, or they tried to fly long range on Spektrum with no RTH, or they tried flying long range on Spektrum using a $5 OrangeRX from Hobby King. Or they just never used it because someone scolded them not to, and they're simply parroting what they were told to do.
My experience with Spektrum was always positive. The only time I ever had a lockout was using the older DSM2 in high RF environments with a high noise floor. Once I went to DSMX that never happened again. I flew gliders Line Of Sight on DSMX for a year before I flew FPV and had zero lockouts, and I often would range quite far out. I tested my quad throughly before I ever even attempted FPV. For a range test I took the props off of the quad, powered it up and and set it in a window of my house. Then I got in my car and drove to the top of a six story high parking garage that was 540 meters away. From the top of the parking garage I verified that I was able to recieve video with the Fatsharks and also arm and spin up the motors on my quad.

I am not familar with the Devo 10 but I would research successes/failures with it and go from there. I'm fairly certain I saw people using that transmitter at the DC Area Drone User Group event a couple of weeks ago. From my experiences Spektrum, Futaba, Hitec, JR, Airtronics, are all good radios. Turnigy is good if you set it up right but it may take a little "hacking" on your part. If you use 2.4 for control you just have to be aware of the limitations and not push it. If you are new to flying and new to FPV flying beyond Line Of Sight is a bad idea anyhow. When starting out get a friend to act as a spotter and stay within LOS. You'll still have a lot of fun, trust me!

When I was researching my setup I watched all of the tutorial videos in the first post of the thread I've linked here. I believe this was key to my success. From day 1 when I first powered it all up everything in my system has just worked. I'm convinced that's because I did all the homework beforehand before I even pulled the trigger.

http://fpvlab.com/forums/showthread.php?116-FPV-PILOT-TRAINING-CENTER-YOUR-ROAD-TO-FPV-SUCCESS

 

[ummagawd]

Thanks smooth. I've watched a ton of videos, but not the ones in your link, I'll check those out (even though I'll be sticking to micro-quads for now).